RealEngine v1.1, in the FSX Misc section

[Daube]

Hi all,

Did anybody test this addon module nammed "RealEngine v1.1", posted recently in the FSX Misc download section of the site ? It sounds very interesting: it seems that this module will generate engine failures based on the various engine parameters like oil temperature etc....

If it really does what is promised, it might add a lot of immersion in the flights of the piston engines in FS.

Before that, I was already using the aircraft.cfg parameters that damages the engine when the maximum manifold pressure is exceeded (this is a FSX Acceleration feature). I will hopefully be able to test this module tonight and will report here about my conclusions on it.

I have big expectations, so I fear I'll be dissapointed somehow. However, I don't like the fact that you can do almost anything to your eninges in FS without risking anything, so I really hope this module make the FS skies a little bit more "dangerous" for the engines, and the successfull flights more rewarding for the carefull pilots...

[ShaneG_old]

I just downloaded it earlier, but haven't tried it yet.

It sounds really cool, and they claim it works in both versions of FS.

I'll be interested in hearing your review of it.

[Brett_Henderson]

This is a really nifty bit of software... It's not, 'plug-n-go'.. but those interested in what it offers, will no doubt take the time to learn it  8-)

[ShaneG_old]

[quote]This is a really nifty bit of software... It's not, 'plug-n-go'.. but those interested in what it offers, will no doubt take the time to learn it

[Brett_Henderson]

Let's see how it goes...  I was a tester, and took it to the next level.. even tweaking gauge response in the air-file..

If there's enough interest, a Q&A might be worth it's own thread...

[ShaneG_old]

[quote]Let's see how it goes...

[wilycoyote4]

If I understand correctly it is set up for the default Baron so use it there first.  Then follow instructions to set up other aircraft.

Unless others post their setup for other aircraft.

[Daube]

I've been reading the readme.
One needs to know the exact "danger" values for all the parameters of a given plane, then manually edit the XML gauges to include those values (for example, edit the RPM damage gauge to write the actual max RPM of this given plane), and then include those gauges into the panel.cfg.

The problem is that for some planes, it's quite difficult to know the correct values. For example, some planes do not have a red zone in the manifold pressure gauge, so it's hard to say which value is dangerous, unless you read it in some documentation somewhere.

I'm definitely interested in those gauges. I didn't realize they were already set for the default Baron, I was trying to include them to Piglet's Skyraider

This will need time.

[ShaneG_old]

If there's enough interest, a Q&A might be worth it's own thread...

Unless others post their setup for other aircraft.

This would definitely be worth a sticky, but as it's getting a bit crowded in here for them,
Aircraft & 3D Design board would be a good place for it perhaps?


Brett, is there a major difference in the functions between FSX & FS9 using this?

[Brett_Henderson]

I don't know..

[teson1]

...  I was a tester, ...

Brett, you were the key tester... Thanks again! and thanks for bringing me in here.

- FS2004/FSX: Functionality should be the same with FS2004 and FSX.

I only have FS2004, and have tested it very extensively there. Brett has tried in FSX without issue.

And the code is pretty straightforward XML - reading a few A: variables, doing some calculations and returning K: effects, engine failure or trim. I don't see how there could be any issue with FSX (but then I hope I'm not sticking my tongue out too much...)
This is probably also the place to admit that this is my first gauge project, so while I have worked on it quite some time, I'm certainly far from expert in gauge programming.

- Default parameters are set-up for the default Baron 58 as stated, so that's a good plane to test out RealEngine.

But please consider that these values are only for familiarisation - don't expect that they are "real", like that the real engine would fail if these limitations are exceeded. The real engine will not fail for a very long time even if run at full power. In fact maximum continuous MP/RPM for the Baron 55 (didn't find a 58 POH) is TO power (full power), which seems to be true for many non-charged GA aircraft... (please also note that I have NO experience with real aircraft). (Recommended cruise parameters are another set of values though.)

The default values entered for the Baron are more limiting, forcing one to pay real attention to power or MP/RPM settings in the different phases of the flight.
(and I have to admit I'm not really happy with RPM/MP limitation values entered for the Baron - I prefer to use the power% module for engine control).

- Suggestion for determining likely starting values for an aircraft where no POH is available:

The 50 xml or so modules in the RealEngine folder may seem quite daunting, but normally only 4 of them really need individual adjustment for an airplane:

RE1_EnginePowerLimitations_EngineRoughnessFailure_v10.xml
RE1_EngineMPRPMLimitations_EngineRoughnessFailure_v10.xml
(You'll typically only want to use either the MP/RPM or the Power modules to control engine damage.)
RE1_FlapsOverspeed_Failure_v10.xml
RE1_GearOverspeed_Failure_v10.xml

For starting with a new plane without POH or engine operating data, I'd follow these steps:

After installing RealEngine in the panel folder and panel.cfg:
1. Enter the real Flaps and gear limitations in the RE1_ .xml modules for flaps and gear. Gear and flaps speed limitations should be pretty readily available.
CHT, Oil temperature limitations have probably pretty reasonable values for most planes by default.
The other failure effects (plug fouling, lean/rich mixture limit) should work as is for most planes.

Start FS and a flight from a sea level airport.

2. Pause all modules ("Pause all" button in the status panel)

3. Take off from a sea level airport at full power. Note Power (HP) reached, indicated in the status panel - that will be a reasonable starting value for maximum engine HP.

4. Exit FS (or switch to another plane) and enter this HP value into the RE1_EnginePowerLimitations_EngineRoughnessFailure_v10.xml module.

5. Start a flight, (pause the MP/RPM module, by clicking on the MP RPM line in the status panel, to avoid it generating a failure).
You can then do some test flights, and have to respect the default % power limitations - 85% power for climb, 75% for best power cruise (rich), 65% for best economy cruise (lean mixture), as well as the other limits.

Then the tweaking phase can starts - looking for information on the plane performance, limitations and operating recommendations, and deciding what values to enter...

- In the end, RealEngine is a toolbox that hopefully allows to pick the failure modules that you like, drop those that you don't like, and set the parameters to values that seem right to you, and require from you the needed measure of attention.
The main effect of RealEngine, rather rendering flying and engine management really realistic, I believe, is to force one to pay attention to power, MP, RPM, speeds ect, in a  way similar a real pilot would do, who will want to take care of his plane.

At least I I hope it achieves this.

And I hope you have some fun using it.
Thanks for trying it out in any way.

Gunter

[teson1]

And just an important note - I really hope to get some feedback from real pilots what values "seem right" to them. Make one control the engine as one would do in a real plane...

[ShaneG_old]

Welcome to Simviation, and THANK YOU for the work you are doing to bring this type "personal detail" to the simming community. 

I've striven to fly my low & slow planes more realistically ever since Brett took me for my first real world flight,
and I believe this addon will really help me to further achieve that goal.  [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

[SeanTK]

Looks excellent!

I haven't dug into it yet, but I am wondering if you can sustain engine damage from idling below # rpm for a certain time period.
I know that when I was training, we were advised against idling below 1000 rpm due the carbon deposit issue, among other things, which can ultimately lead to at least a rough running engine. (It's been a while, going off memory here...)

Wondering if it's also possible (maybe a future idea) to shock cool the engine of the plane in question?

Great work so far! This really brings a new level of realism to FS fixed-wing operations! 

[Brett_Henderson]

It does "punish" you for sustained, low RPM (simlated plug fowling).. and even allows you to "clean" the plugs in a VERY realistic manner.

Shock cooling would be more of a long-term thing. Like if you shock-cool flight after flight, eventually total failure happens. This system doesn't store long-term abuse accumulation.

As for setting it up... it takes some work and testing, but after your first model, it goes quickly. You'll find that at first you really wanna make yourself fly carefully, and might get a little too strict..lol

I've always tried to sim as though I was paying for not just the fuel, but maintanence too. So it hasn't changed the way I sim. Real numbers worked pretty well for me, though I had to cheat a little on sustained RPMs (set the limit high), because I hold notthing back on takeoff, and set RPMs to high, well before landing.

En-route is a piece of cake, cause when it's YOUR wallet filling the fuel tanks.. you always fly well under limitations.

I was particulary interested in temperature management, and realistic/disciplined cowl-flap use. To get this fine-tuned, you might have to venture into the air-file, and play with CHT numbers..