VSYNC in Flight Simulator 2004

[FridayChild]

In my endless struggle to eliminate blurries (which, in my case, are mostly due to a limited amount of VRAM) I've tried to disable the VSYNC in my video card driver properties, and I set the "maximum pre-rendered frames" to a very high value (250, which is ten times my frame rate limit of 25; which means that the CPU can pre-render up to 10 seconds of images). The idea is to have the CPU work in behalf of the GPU instead of basically sitting waiting for the next scene to be rendered. I'm under the impression that this actually helps: I set VSYNC to on, had a lot of blurries, paused FS and switched off VSYNC (and pre-render to 250), then came back to FS and the blurries had mostly gone. Anyway, I found that VSYNC off causes some tearing of the image.
What are your thoughts?

[ctjoyce]

All V sync does is keeps your frames from exceding your refresh rate. So if you have your refresh rate set to 75mhz, then your FPS will not excede 75FPS.

Cheers
Cameron

[FridayChild]

Yep, I know that, but - at least with my video card driver - the only way to enable that pre-rendering feature (i.e. have the CPU pre-chew data to relieve some burden from the GPU) is to turn Vsync off. You can't have one without the other. And in turn, turning Vsync on causes some tearing.
So my questions are:
1) in your experience, does CPU pre-rendering actually reduce blurries
2) do you know of a way to set up the system so that, with Vsync off, tearing is reduced to a minimum?

[justpassingthrough]

Vsync should be set to APPLICATION PREFERENCE or 'use 3D Application' not ON or OFF

When I was running FS9 I used the settings NickN posted and also did his system optimizing suggestions: http://www.simviation.com/cgi-bin/yabb2 ... 53;start=0


I dont have a copy of the link but I did save a copy of what he posted for setting up the sim, the configuration file and drivers:

====================================

FS9 CONFIGURATION FILE REBUILD


Save a copy of your current FS9.cfg file in a safe place. Then DELETE the FS9.cfg file being used by the sim.

Start Flight Simulator. You will be starting clean with a new FS9.cfg file Let the sim boot and go to the SETTINGS area. Make the following changes:

DISPLAY BUTTON:

[FridayChild]

Some questions:

"Vsync should be set to APPLICATION PREFERENCE or 'use 3D Application' not ON or OFF"
This means "let FS9 decide". What does FS9 decide about Vsync? On or Off?

"TextureMaxLoad=8 //This is a setting that is not very well known, copy it exactly as it is shown here. It can fix blurries if the right TexBan Mult is used"
What is TexBan Mult, and what is the right setting?

"Anisotropic Mip filter optimization = ON
Anisotropic sample optimization = ON
Texture Filtering= HIGH QUALITY //Also try QUALITY (note: set the optimizers first before setting this to HIGH QUALITY)"
From what I gather of the display driver online help, optimizations are unavailable/off by default if High Quality is selected. That is, setting them to on or off should not be relevant.

[justpassingthrough]

Some questions:

"Vsync should be set to APPLICATION PREFERENCE or 'use 3D Application' not ON or OFF"
This means "let FS9 decide". What does FS9 decide about Vsync? On or Off?

"TextureMaxLoad=8 //This is a setting that is not very well known, copy it exactly as it is shown here. It can fix blurries if the right TexBan Mult is used"
What is TexBan Mult, and what is the right setting?

"Anisotropic Mip filter optimization = ON
Anisotropic sample optimization = ON
Texture Filtering= HIGH QUALITY //Also try QUALITY (note: set the optimizers first before setting this to HIGH QUALITY)"
From what I gather of the display driver online help, optimizations are unavailable/off by default if High Quality is selected. That is, setting them to on or off should not be relevant.

1. FS9 varies Vsync to ON when it's needed which is where it should be in the drivers, but not all applications work best with the drivers set to ON so setting it to 'application' makes sure it is right for all software

2. TexBan Mult was my abbriviation for =TEXTURE_BANDWIDTH_MULT and the setting shown above is correct (between 80 and 110 for your card... 160 for 512mb fast cards) The 2nd setting TextureMaxLoad= is a setting the FS9 developers left out of the file.

Keep in mind the below was posted for FSX.. FS9 is different. Using the TextureMaxLoad= with the correct TEXTURE_BANDWIDTH_MULT forces FS9 to render and sharpen ground textures. FSX does not have the TextureMaxLoad= switch available to it and is a constant that can not be changed.

Here is the math and how it works:

======================================================

Texture bandwidth multiplier is max at 400. 400 is the max in both FS9 and FSX. That has been posted by both FS9 and FSX developers. If the value (or any value) of a line in the config file is not present or is not within the specified program range set by the developers when the sim is booted, the value will default. The default values when such things occur are unknown for many of the settings.

[FridayChild]

Thanks so much. I will try all these tweaks as soon as possible and keep you posted.

EDIT: I've tried all the tweaks except installing NVTweak (so I wasn't able to set the driver to High Quality while at the same time turning on the optimizers). As soon as possible I'll install .NET 2 and NVTweak, but having applied all the other tweaks (FS options, FS9.CFG modifications, driver settings) I am still getting blurries; to be honest I didn't notice a difference even though I've changed so many things.
I'm beginning to think that my system and/or video card is just not good enough for a demanding application like FS9.

[Ivan]

Vsync has only use if you have an app that
1: in 90% of the time gets more FPS than you have Hz
2: allows FPS to be locked also to prevent fps rate fluctuations (lock it to monitor Hz)

For all tech junkies that are bragging about getting 120 fps in old games... if using a 60Hz flatcreen, you'll be wasting 50% of your videocard power as you arent getting over 60fps on the output EVER.

So if you want to impress your school friends with high 3dmark scores... keep it off.
If you want a stutter free game experience... Set VSync on, limit your framerate to the refresh, and use the excess cycles for eyecandy.

[FridayChild]

Maybe I'm missing something here.
It should be: turn your vsync on, set a reasonable frame rate limit below the display refresh rate, and use the spared resources for eye candy.
Anyway, it seems that, at least with NVidia driver, the only way to have the CPU pre-process some of the scenes to be rendered, is to turn vsync off. If vsync is on, no scene pre-processing is done by the CPU.
The ideal would be to have vsync on and the CPU pre-processing, but as it is...

[Ivan]

Doesnt count for FS9... that graphics engine will never do 100FPs in the coming 4 years (too much still on processor side).

On Unreal Tournament (original) you can go WAY over the refresh rate with a current machine

[FridayChild]

Mm, I'm not after faster frame rates. 25 fps is fine for me.
What I am looking for are sharp ground textures. If the CPU can do some of the rendering, then sweet deal.

[DizZa]

Vsync dosn't always cause stutters or image tearing.  I find it's better to leave it off to gain an additional frame rate or two - yes, it does affect performance (slightly). I think it's best for you to find what setting you like)

[flymo]

Vsync dosn't always cause stutters or image tearing.  I find it's better to leave it off to gain an additional frame rate or two - yes, it does affect performance (slightly). I think it's best for you to find what setting you like)

as said above VSYNC locks your frames to your rehresh rate, so if you are running ahed of your refresh rate i.e. 100fps ona 60mhz monitor VSYNC will help in performance as it will free up resources. VSYNC is also used to prevent getting "rips" on the screen.