Dueling

[Craig.]

Ja i know but im not fond of the euro****er


True True..

Ive heard all the reports on the Euro,
and i cant say im realy impressed...
the only thing ive got to say is its got a good thrust to weight ratio...

But it will have some horible gremlins when its in service..

And i would take a Su-27 or 37 anyday over the typhoon...

But if they decide to get the optinal air con, and thrust vectoring... i'll be happy in my eyes, that its got a little bit of russia inside it

It doesnt need thrust vectoring. It adds weight and couldn't improve its agility enough to make it worth it.
I certainly would take the Typhoon over anything else. Its true Multi-role. Added to the ability to carry and fire ALCM's at supersonic speeds while running air defence. For the first time since the Lightning the British with some European help have actually designed a capable fighter again.

[|| Andy ||]

But being multirole it looses capability in other areas..

And if it had thrust vectoring..
and the cog was far enough back..
Cobra would be a posibility in dog fights..

[|| Andy ||]

Vat about the hunter?

[Mobius]

Oops, my bad.  Caught me, oh well, I wasn't quite sure on that one.  Sorry folks, most of the other stuff I said should be true though, I think.  I guess I should have known, the DSB Eurofighter in FS has models from all different squadrons.  I'm dumb, sorry.

[|| Andy ||]

lol, just checka raf site www.raf.mod.uk

[Craig.]

said manouver has no use in a dogfight. Its an airshow trick that can overstress the airframe as it is. In a dogfight the loss of speed would mean the plane is easy pickings for a wingman.
And in its ground attack configuration it has shown to be almost as manuverable as its air defence config. Thanks to its thrust to weight ratio its not a huge problem.

[Craig.]

Vat about the hunter?

Came before the Lightning. If i remember correctly. You could have said bucaneer.

[Mobius]

The Cobra could be used in a dogfight situation (see below), however the conditions would have to be just right and the aircraft performing it would be pretty easy pickings for anyone else.

[Craig.]

In one on one combat its possible, but since you never would be in a 1 on 1 situation its still too risky.

[|| Andy ||]

Pitty i can read that ^^

I could of said the bucc...
But its a strike a/c and were talkin fighters here..

[Craig.]

yes it was, but it was the last great british aircraft.

[Craig.]

http://aeroweb.lucia.it/~agretch/RAFAQ/cobra.html
Good page on the cobra maneuver.

[ATI_7500]

Interesting Fact: The B-52 has a smaller RCS than that of an F-15.  ??? wierd

The F-15 is a box with wings,all edgy, while the B-52 is quite round.
The B-1B almost has the RCS of a seagull,btw.

[igorski]

I've just read through this entrie thread, most interesting, the way i understand things currently are as follows:

Typhoon is roughly equivilant to F/A22, with the raptor having slightly better sustained  turn rate (in the order of a few degrees/second faster) thus proving that the Typhoon dosnt really NEED thrust vectoring.. and begging the thought of what could happen it they were included.

However! The F/A22 has a unit cost of around twice that at Typhoon, making it very costly, especially to export, and Typhoon IS stealthy, perhaps not to the extent of F/A22, but it has got stealth incorperatred in the design. Also, typhoon can go vertical, when lightly loaded it has a thrust to reight ratio of > 1

Russia does have some good aircraft.. no ideas on numbers, but the latest versions of the flankers, fulcrums etc are not to be sneezed at, however Typhoon and presumabley FA/22 are designed to defeat these currrent aicraft, and their projected developements and/or replacements.

Numbers are useful, if the aircraft in question has long enough range, radar range and missile range to engage the opposition, now i'd assume that to some extent the typhoon, FA22 and other next gen aircraft will be able to engage aircraft such as Fishbed, earlier Flankers, and Fulcrums etc... before they even knew they were there.

And just to give the ruskis a fair deal, the SU47 or whatever its being called .. *the new FSW one* lol, it looks good, and with FSW design should be manouverable, but the object theses days is to shoot down your enemy from long range, and avoid a dogfight at all costs.. so its good to have manouverability as a backup, but a good set of BVR (beyond visual range) missiles and radar is a good first choice of capability!

hmm what else.. F15 is big and old, but still good until FA/22 is fully in service, then it will be outclassed I think, the F16, being small and very manouverable will be good for a while longer I think, same for F/A18.. I cant believe they want to Replace the F14 with them though!!!!! No way is the FA18 to the same standard as F14!

F35, a worthy replacement to Harrier I feel, the harrier will be THE original effective V/STOL aircraft (yeah there is a a russian one by Yakovlev i think, but is it to the same standard as Harrier?.. and it uses lift jets!) but I think the F35 is a good design.

Ok better stop there... just my thoughts for now.

[|| Andy ||]

Yakovlev 141
Nato designation "Freestyle"


Tis supersonic aswell, but not in service..

Engines:
1 x Kobchenko/Soyuz R-79V-300
2 x Glushenko/Rybinsk RD-41


and Hay! the F-35 uses lift jets