The Great Escape

[ozzy72]

Survivors of the most famous escape in British history were today reunited 60 years on.
Six former prisoners of war who took part in the "The Great Escape" gathered at the Imperial War Museum aviation section at Duxford, near Cambridge, to mark the 60th anniversary of the break-out.
The escape took place on the night of March 24, 1944 when 76 Allied airmen escaped from the infamous Stalag Luft 3 prison camp in Sagan, Germany.
Three reached England, while 50 of those recaptured were shot by the Nazis.
The escape was immortalised in the classic 1963 film The Great Escape, which starred Steve McQueen, James Coburn, Richard Attenborough, Donald Pleasance and Gordon Jackson.
The survivors gathered at Duxford to reminisce and launch a new book, Lie in the Dark and Listen, written by Ken "Shag" Rees, who took part in the escape and was partly the inspiration for Steve McQueen's character, Hilts "The Cooler King", in the film.
"These men were all incredibly brave and their sheer brio and ingenuity is staggering," said a spokeswoman for the museum.
"It is a tremendous honour to have them here at Duxford and to be providing the launch venue for this remarkable book. This really does represent a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to talk to the real people behind one of our wartime stories of heroism and courage."

[Hagar]

I heard about this on the radio earlier in the week. They interviewed some of the ex-prisoners & actors from the film. These included John Leyton & Scottish actor Angus Lennie who played Ives the Mole. From what they were saying, Steve McQueen's & Angus Lennie's characters were the only ones not based on real people.

[ozzy72]

Just found a rather interesting link about the real chaps
http://www.elsham.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/gt_esc
V.Brave men indeed. And fifty paid a terrible price

[ozzy72]

Yes. It's me!! I'm still here.........

I have nothing but great admiration for those blokes (being very claustrophobic). I read The Great Escape when I was about 10. It started a hunger for WWII escape tales that has never really been sated.

I read the "Wooden Horse" around the same time. I just couldn't get enough of them. I've always loved the Movie (Great Escape) too. Very good production, great casting, I believe.

Is it me, or does it seem to anyone else that the Brits (and the fewer Australians that weren't in the Pacific or Jap POW camps), gave the Germans more of a time at escaping than your average Allied POW? (Of course, not to take anything away from those of other Nations who effected brilliant (or failed) escapes.  ;D

[ozzy72]

Brensec you have to remember that large numbers of the RAF weren't British, they were Poles, Czechs, Free French, Dutch, Belgians etc etc.
I think the problem for the Germans was that most of the guys that got shot down were 'hostilities only' personel, and had done v.different things in civilian life, which meant they had the training and skills to make mischief in ways not normally encountered.
Tailors, surveyors, miners etc.
On the whole the Thirs Reich was reasonably honourable towards allied POWs (although the Poles had to anglicise their names for their own safety).
If you want a good film keep an eye out for The Password Is Courage, which is the true story of Sgt. Charles Coward who was a POW. He caused 'nuff mischief Amazing guy, great film

Ozzy

[ozzy72]

Will do.

I saw an escape movie not long ago. It was on Fox (the old movie channel - i think it's called TCM here - Turner Classic Movies), anyway, I digress, as usual...lol

It starred a 'posh' type actor whose name I don't know but he's very reminiscent of Peter Ustinov, but very 'British'. He played some Professor who was some kind of advisor at Whitehall or something and he went on a 'secret' flight and ended up shot down and captured. He, and three others, eventually escaped by stealing a visiting Red Cross Inspection Teams coats and hats and walking out, posing as them.

Does anyone know the one I'm talking about. It was a great movie.

(On a completely different subject, although still on the POW issue. Did I read a few months ago that Douglas Bader made his 'Batman' stay in Colditz, when he had a chance to be repatriated?) If it was him, he was a real a real turd, wasn't he??

[ozzy72]

Not only that, but when his batman was released Bader gave him a real chewing about forgetting to bring his spare pair of legs along!!!
I'm afraid I'm not a fan of Sir Douglas, as having seen a program about him I reached the v.fair conclusion that he was a self-publicising, self-centered megolomaniac... Mind you that isn't an uncommon problem

[Hagar]

I'm afraid I'm not a fan of Sir Douglas, as having seen a program about him I reached the v.fair conclusion that he was a self-publicising, self-centered megolomaniac... Mind you that isn't an uncommon problem

You are not alone. I used to see him on his regular visits to Shoreham back in the 1960s. I was never introduced as he wouldn't have wanted to know me. To say he was not particularly well-liked is an understatement. I respect his skill & determination but always thought he was a typical example of the pre-WWII regular officer corps.

[Smoke2much]

My father met him once.  Thought he was an arrogant, self centered, jumped up little twat.

Will

[greekydeke]

Could the idea and the techniques the POWs had and used for their escape have come from (or been inspired by) Jean Paul Renoir's 1937-1938 movie "Grand Illusion"??  In that film (based on the exploits and escapes of a WWI French pilot, and Renoir's own flying experiences in The Great War) the French POWs in the film used virtually identical tunneling and dirt removal techniques to escape from one of the WWI stalags they were in as the British POWs did in their great escape in WWII.  Does anyone know if there was  a connection between the two, or was the escape tunnel idea and techniques something that POWs of both wars (and on both sides) knew about and commonly used??

[Smoke2much]

I think it may well be logical progression.  You ahve barbed wire between you and freedom.  You can either go over it, through it or under it.  the only way to keep it a secret is to go under it (in normal circumstances) so the tunnel is the best option.

Will

[greekydeke]

Thanks, but what I was really wondering about was that the all the tunneling and dirt removal techniques in Renoir's late 1930's film  "Grand Illusion" (e.g., French aircrew POW's using string-tied cloth bags under their greatcoats and uniforms to dump  tunnel dirt in the POW vegetable garden, tin-can air hose, emergency extraction of tunnel diggers, tunnel supports obtained from buildings in the stalag, worrying about the location of the endpoint and exit of the tunnel, etc.) were so oddly identical to what the British POWs did later on in the mid-1940s.  My question was about a possible connection between the two.  In other words, were British aircrews briefed on tunnelling and dirt removal techniques in escape and evasion lectures, and if so, what part (if any) did the experience of escapees from German POW camps in WWI play in developing lecture content?  When I was a young boy a family friend was an Eagle, shot down over France and interned in a stalag.  Never thought to ask him (and he never felt like telling) about his being a pilot in one of the Eagle squadrons, his combat experiences, or his being a POW in WWII.  

[Stratobat]

I read a book about a year ago about Colditz Prison, the author (P. Reid I think) made reference to the fact that the Germans had sound detectors. Does anybody know when the Germans started using these devices?

Regards,
Stratobat

[ozzy72]

Hi Strato, the Mr. Reid series was three books in total (I only have the middle one), but if memory serves (I've handed the book over to a friend temporarily) the Germans used accoustic detectors in early '41, but they had lots of problems with them as rats eating/burrowing near them caused them to go a little haywire. And then the Colditz guards could spend half a day digging towards a tunnel only to find Roland Rat was manufacturing lots of little Rolands

Ozzy

[Stratobat]

Hey Ozzy,

I'm not sure which one of the three I read, but I went through it in a few hours. It was an excellent read. I googled Colditz and came up with a site that made referrence to the Glider that they had build in the loft at Colditz and how the locals there destroyed it after the war. I think a replica was built in the end to replace the original.

Colditz guards could spend half a day digging towards a tunnel only to find Roland Rat was manufacturing lots of little Rolands

LMAO... That must have hacked them off no end

Regards,
Stratobat