Controlled Airspace...

[flaminghotsauce]

Rotty, my PPL training involved C and D airspace all the time, VFR, even though the airport I was based out of was uncontrolled.

[beaky]

[quote]Rotty, my PPL training involved C and D airspace all the time, VFR, even though the airport I was based out of was uncontrolled.

[Brett_Henderson]

And... don't forget what will never be acknowledged.. sometimes they just don't want to be bothered. I've tried to fly a course that takes me through a procession of B,C,D airpspaces, dozens of times.. heading north from Columbus, Ohio through: Toledo, Detroit Metro, Detroit City, Ann Arbor, Willow Run, Pontiac, and Flint. If you think you can get through there by FF, you'll soon find out otherwise... and even if you file IFR (on a beautiful VFR day), you'll get an amended clearance routing you WAY around the area. The only time FF near Detroit went smoothly for me, was when I was flying to small airport where you'd have no choice but to transition. And even then, they couldn't wait to get rid of me.. I finally just called, "airport in sight", so I could actually concentrate on finding it (had a GPS so I knew I'd see it soon enough), instead of listening to him get annoyed with me.. calling every 20 seconds  >:(

A typical flight would start with me contacting Cleveland Center for FF (50/50 chance that they'd be too busy ).. they'd hand me to Toledo Approach.. they'd hand me to Metro Approach, who would promply vector me WAY to the west, and then dump me, suggesting Minneapolis Approach ..which I know is a waste of time, 'cause they'd jump at the chance to hand me to Pontiac, or Flint.. who'd almost immediately dump me, telling me to try  Minneapolis again. After finally getting north of that area, being the sole property of Minneapolis, I'd be near my first fuel stop.. and I know from shooting instrument approaches in that area, they lose radar contact of me below 3000msl  ::)

Now.. I just make sure the transponder is on.. let Cleveland know where I'm heading... if they dump me.. I just plug along until north of that mess and stop for fuel. If it's a nice weekend day.. I'll contact Minneapoils after the fuel stop .. otherwise, it's more work and more distraction than it's worth.

[beaky]

[quote]And... don't forget what will never be acknowledged.. sometimes they just don't want to be bothered. I've tried to fly a course that takes me through a procession of B,C,D airpspaces, dozens of times.. heading north from Columbus, Ohio through: Toledo, Detroit Metro, Detroit City, Ann Arbor, Willow Run, Pontiac, and Flint. If you think you can get through there by FF, you'll soon find out otherwise... and even if you file IFR (on a beautiful VFR day), you'll get an amended clearance routing you WAY around the area. The only time FF near Detroit went smoothly for me, was when I was flying to small airport where you'd have no choice but to transition. And even then, they couldn't wait to get rid of me.. I finally just called, "airport in sight", so I could actually concentrate on finding it (had a GPS so I knew I'd see it soon enough), instead of listening to him get annoyed with me.. calling every 20 seconds

[DaveSims]

I think it is important to point out, that just because you have FF, you must still remain vigilant.  I had a near head-on with a Mooney years ago (he was westbound at 5500, I was eastbound same altitude).  While I was on FF, they never detected him, for whatever reason.

[Fozzer]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSA_Flight_182

A fascinating read...

..and a wake-up call, even for we Flight Sim Pilots during our flights, using the Default ATC communication!

Even with all the aircrafts transponders switched on and contacting the Tower..."things" can still go disastrously wrong without a constant "look-out"!

Its amazing how small the sky can suddenly become when there is a big Jumbo Jet right on your C150's tail....and he hasn't spotted you!... ...!

Paul...G-BPLF... 8-)...!

[BAW0343]

From what I've gotten out of my classes this semester is ATC is actually not allowed to control any aircraft in that space. So as long as your 1000 ft above the surface around the cities, your within FAA regulations, then you have 200 ft to play with that ATC is not even allowed to contact you within, correct?

I think you're looking at ATC wrongly. They are there to HELP YOU. You should WANT radar tracking in busy airspace for your protection and for others operating in that airspace. It's an insurance policy. Rather than risk life and limb flying in among the towers, wires, birds, and floating Walmart bags, talking to ATC clears you to safer altitudes, with vectors if necessary, and traffic clearance, warnings and such. They are charged with helping even the small aircraft, so it's in your best interest to seek them out, rather than try to avoid ATC.

Sorry, just came back to this thread and wanted to clarify. I think you read my post wrong as I was just trying to discuss different ways you could avoid those busy airspace's if you wanted to. I have absolutely nothing against ATC, in fact I'm currently in school working on becoming one myself so I know that they are there to help. However, sometimes they can get overloaded with IFR traffic so having some VFR avoid them would be a big stress reliever on both the controller and the pilot.

I never said I would want to fly in G class airspace, I was just mentioning it as an option  :)