Gliding scholarship... Counts towards PPL?

[machineman9]

When I am 16 in February, my parents were thinking of helping to pay towards some flying lessons. With the current crisis relating to fuel, no doubt it is going to be a bit more expensive per hour than a few months or years back.

Anyway... When I am 16 I can also apply for a gliding scholarship with cadets, which as I am aware is currently fully free (aside petrol costs to get there) and looks like a good way to get experience before I actually take up lessons.

I am wondering if hours from my gliding scholarship (I believe it is something like 8 hours minimum in the Vigilant, the powered glider I will probably fly) could be counted towards my PPL, as not only would this save hours and money... but also if I took the scholarship then I would have the experience aswell from flying around which could help me progress quicker too.


Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Would it be good to go for the scholarship first, and then progress onto lessons? Should I wait until I am 17 and hope for a full flying scholarship aswell?

I don't know how often the places come up, but does it sound like a good plan?

I have no idea how the fuel costs will change in the future, but hopefully for the better.


Cheers

[C]

Do it anyway. Take every opportunity you can get for "free" flying.

[machineman9]

Do it anyway. Take every opportunity you can get for "free" flying.

I'm probably going to, but I am just checking to see if it will help me with hours towards a PPL aswell.

[Mictheslik]

Take your parent's money and spend it on driving instead......a PPL is cool, but not really that useful unless you can afford to rent aircraft and pay loads for fuel. You're better off spending the money on driving lessons when you're 17 and on insurance and fuel for the car etc rather than a PPL......Take the free gliding course though.....it's free

Remember also that your parents may be willing to fund a few flying lessons.....but you need more than a few to get a PPL. Although more exciting/fun, all the flying will result in is a loss of money and a constant urge to fly (which is irritating 'cos you can't afford to).

I was in the same situation a few months ago and chose driving over flying......it's just more sensible.....

.mic

[machineman9]

Well I am joining the cool folk and getting a motorbike probably (they on average seem to be a bit cheaper, and will offer me a good mileage for what I want to do)

I could do that though. I mean, one of the reasons why I was going to start learning at 16 was because I would be able to get an alrightish job at that age... work and pay towards lessons.


I shall have a word in a bit. I do want to become a pilot at the end of the day... I just need to get priorities. I will still try and get an hour of aerobatic flight if not. That looks like so much fun for a birthday, lol. Depends how 'hands-on' I would be though.

[Fozzer]

Take your parent's money and spend it on driving instead......a PPL is cool, but not really that useful unless you can afford to rent aircraft and pay loads for fuel. You're better off spending the money on driving lessons when you're 17 and on insurance and fuel for the car etc rather than a PPL......Take the free gliding course though.....it's free

Remember also that your parents may be willing to fund a few flying lessons.....but you need more than a few to get a PPL. Although more exciting/fun, all the flying will result in is a loss of money and a constant urge to fly (which is irritating 'cos you can't afford to).

I was in the same situation a few months ago and chose driving over flying......it's just more sensible.....

.mic

...those are the wisest words I have ever heard on a Flight Sim Forum...

.... ...!

[beaky]

I don't know about the UK rules, but over here the glider rating doesn't count officially towards a powered-aircraft PP.
However, it counts big-time in saving you time and money getting that PP... you will already know a great deal about flight, weather, regulations, etc... this should make for a steep learning curve.
And if it's paid for by scholarship, why not?

I understand why you might be thinking twice about laying aside the powered-aircraft lessons, but IMHO, you should think about enjoying flying those machines while the fuel can be had at all... "better to have loved and lost", etc.

If I could never fly a powered aircraft again, I wouldn't consider all that money I spent wasted, even though I never did anything practical with it.

I even had to lay off flying for a few years, mostly due to money... but I came back as soon as I could, just because i could.

Even if you can't keep it going for a lifetime, or to any "practical" point, money turned into noise flying behind a prop is hardly wasted money!!  ;)

And maybe you'll have your PP when the first practical electric jobs come out...

[Hagar]

Anyway... When I am 16 I can also apply for a gliding scholarship with cadets, which as I am aware is currently fully free (aside petrol costs to get there) and looks like a good way to get experience before I actually take up lessons.

This an interesting question. I don't know what the regulations are regarding pure gliders but I think the Vigilant is classed as a motor-glider which might well be different. Your CO should either know the answer or who to ask about finding out. Whatever the outcome I would definitely grab that gliding scholarship with both hands.

Things are different now from when I was in the ATC but if you do well on the Gliding Scholarship you might be recommended for a Flying Scholarship which will definitely count towards a PPL. (In my day you would end up with a full PPL at the end of the course.) http://www.aircadets.org/flying_fs_1.html

PS. Shame you didn't post this a couple of days ago. The local VGS had a stand at the Shoreham air display yesterday complete with a Vigilant. I could have asked them about it.

[machineman9]

Yeh I definately want to do the flying scholarship one day. I thought it was for over 17s, but that link (which i visited earlier) says 16, but with GCSEs. I will be getting my results about this time next year, so I shall have to apply then.

Its quite funny how they advertise it with the Eurofighter. I would love to learn PPL in that, lol.

I don't know about a PPL, but the hours you are given don't seem quite sufficient. Something like 12 hours in the tutor, and PPL is 38 hours minimum, I think, depending on the type you take.

[Hagar]

Yeh I definately want to do the flying scholarship one day. I thought it was for over 17s, but that link (which i visited earlier) says 16, but with GCSEs. I will be getting my results about this time next year, so I shall have to apply then.

As I said before, the best person to ask is your CO. I think you're expected to complete the Gliding Scholarship first. Selection might then depend on how well you do on that as there is only a limited number of places.

Its quite funny how they advertise it with the Eurofighter. I would love to learn PPL in that, lol.

The idea is that you join the RAF & end up flying service aircraft like the Typhoon.

I don't know about a PPL, but the hours you are given don't seem quite sufficient. Something like 12 hours in the tutor, and PPL is 38 hours minimum, I think, depending on the type you take.

You're thinking of the NPPL which is a minimum of 32 hours. These days the Flying Scholarship entitles you to 12 hours tuition which will count towards a full PPL if you wish to continue privately. There's no guarantee that this would be enough for you to go solo. There are other options. Read this DOC for full information. http://www.aircadets.org/pdf/aircadetpilotscheme0607.doc

[EGNX]

According to my good friends that fly Vigilants with 644 VGS they cannot record any flying time towards a PPL. I'm not quite sure why. It may be due to the fact that it is classed as a motor glider or simply because during your scholarship you're not actually being taught by a qualified civilian instructor or equivalent.
I hold no licence and I cannot fly any other gliders other than VGS ones, yet I am 'instructor'. So, if I took you up and taught you how to fly, really its just the same as sitting in the right seat with someone who has a PPL and them just showing you the controls, if you get what I mean.

Although my best advice would be to get onto your Gliding Scholarship as soon as you are 16, go solo and then stay on as a Flight Staff Cadet and get as much free flying training as possible (even if it doesn't count to a PPL - it's still invaluable)

Then as soon as you become an FSC apply for a Flying Scholarship and you will get that in no time!  ;)

[machineman9]

Thanks for the help.

At first I thought it might have been because they weren't really qualified to teach PPLs, but can teach for that particular aircraft.

I haven't really thought about being flight staff myself. If I do, then do I remain with my ATC Sqn, but joing the other (probably 632VGS) at the weekends, or how does that work?

[C]

Two documents may well help you find the answer:

1) LASORS 2008 from the CAA

and...

2) IIRC the NPPL website has a bit in its FAQ about SLMG hours counting towards the NPPL, and I doubt the PPL is that different.

[EGNX]

Thanks for the help.

At first I thought it might have been because they weren't really qualified to teach PPLs, but can teach for that particular aircraft.

I haven't really thought about being flight staff myself. If I do, then do I remain with my ATC Sqn, but joing the other (probably 632VGS) at the weekends, or how does that work?

Simply come down at weekends as a member of your VGS alongside going to cadets during the week. Nothing stops you doing it, just as long as the VGS wants you to keep coming. That's the way you have to do it until you are 18, and then you can become a CGI. But you have to be a cadet to be a Flight Staff Cadet.

[machineman9]

Ah cool. How flexible would it be for me? What sort of attendance do they expect, or how is it arranged for when people need to go down?