Aerobatic Flying

[aeroengineer]

I just went up for my first aerobatic flight today in a Pitts S-2C and was wondering if many people had actual aerobatic flight time and if anyone knows if there are any larger flight sticks you can buy than your standard joystick to make aerobatic flying in FSX seem more realistic.

[Splinter562]

I've got about 20 hrs aerobatic time, mostly in a Decathlon. Unfortunatly, there's not much you can do to make FSX seem more realistic for aerobatic flying. You can do the basic maneuvers alright: loops, aileron rolls, barrel rolls. But FSX has trouble simulating the more interesting (and aerodynamically complicated) maneuvers: hammer heads, tail slides, spins, snap rolls, knife edges, etc.

Aside from problems simulating the maneuvers, one the the biggest hurdles, in my opinion, of any desktop flight sim is the view. Even something as simple as a loop requires you to move your head from forward to the wing tip to up and back to forward again in a short period of time. It is difficult to keep up with that on a hat switch. Tracker IR probably solves that problem, but I'll let someone who has it speak to that point.

As for a stick, Saitek makes a pretty good one. The one I have they don't make anymore, but the X-52 looks pretty good.

It seems that you've been bitten by the aerobatics bug as many here have. Unfortunatly there is only one way that you'll truly be able to get your fix, and it's expensive. If you can spare the cash, I'd recommend finding a good aerobatics instructor and do the real deal. The Citabria I fly now is about the same price as a 172 and the Decathlon I flew before that I was getting for a steal at $85/hr.

[aeroengineer]

Thanks for the advice Splinter, I already have a Sidewinder 2, but I just don't like how you mainly use your wrist on the small stick compared to the actual large stick in the Pitts. I've been looking at getting the Track IR, but unfortunately I need to make a huge computer upgrade first which might not be for another year as I am finishing my last year in getting my Aerospace Engineering degree. The ride in the Pitts was the greatest ride I've ever had since it has such a high thrust to weight ratio and the controls are so responsive that it takes nothing to do torque rolls, regular rolls, and loops. I have never quite been able to complete a good hammer head in the simulator, but I sure loved doing it in real life. Maybe someday I will be able to afford a fun little stunt plane since flying one is better than spending an entire day on the greatest rollercoasters made.

[beaky]

I've seen some simple-looking stick extensions, which involve putting the stick on the floor between your legs... but I don't think there's much you can do about twist-grip rudder control except to buy or make rudder pedals.

[C]

Thanks for the advice Splinter, I already have a Sidewinder 2, but I just don't like how you mainly use your wrist on the small stick compared to the actual large stick in the Pitts. I've been looking at getting the Track IR, but unfortunately I need to make a huge computer upgrade first which might not be for another year as I am finishing my last year in getting my Aerospace Engineering degree. The ride in the Pitts was the greatest ride I've ever had since it has such a high thrust to weight ratio and the controls are so responsive that it takes nothing to do torque rolls, regular rolls, and loops. I have never quite been able to complete a good hammer head in the simulator, but I sure loved doing it in real life. Maybe someday I will be able to afford a fun little stunt plane since flying one is better than spending an entire day on the greatest rollercoasters made.

Track IR may make a small difference, but that main aerobatic sense of course is visual, and with most home systems, full 360 degree visuals aren't really possible.

If it makes you feel any better, you actually get the same problem in "real" flight simulators. Aerobatics could never really be accurately flown in the Tucano simulator when I was a user of that.

As for the stick, a home made extension is probably the only affordable way forward, with careful calibration.

[Mobius]

You could get a yoke and simulate an Aerobat.

That way, you couldn't do the more interesting stuff because of the aircraft, not the sim, except for snap rolls, the Aerobat does those nicely.

[Boss_BlueAngels]

Pitts S2-C eh?  I'd take that!  

One thing I recommend is actually a different simulator.  MSFS is terrible when it comes to maneuvers.  Even the basics, IMHO.  You can't do true knife edge flight in their, and therefore you cannot complete a true slow roll and maintain constant altitude.  But, when I do feel the urge to fly upside down and so loops in FSX I set the virtual cockpit zoom to 40.  That works best for me.  And as for maximum realism... there is only so much you can do on the ground since it's impossible to simulate G forces, ya know?  Things get much more complicated at -3 and +5 G's.  

I also have IL2: 1946 and have found that to be extremely useful when practicing maneuvers.  You can do the more complicated maneuvers and some of the heavier warbirds seem to exhibit similar roll/pitc/yaw rates to the Decathlon.  And with that sim I just use the regular POV hat and that works just fine.