Regional Airlines - Pilot Wages

[Slotback]

$24000, if you're lucky.

http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/showthread.php?t=74

[DaveSims]

You do have to put it in perspective.  Being an airline pilot is almost like having a part time job.  The FAA restricts the number of hours the pilots can fly each month, so while making over $20 an hour, at the end of the year you only get $20000.  

[Slotback]

Only that being an airline pilot isn't like a part time job - you get paid like one though.

[RitterKreuz]

Though the pay is part time the hours are far from it.

Here is a typical trip i work, it is a "high paying" 4 day trip taken directly from my trip book last month (times have been rounded to the nearest even minute):

DAY ONE

Leg One: 12:45PM - 2:30PM
Leg Two: 3:30PM   - 5:00PM
*one hour dinner break*
Leg Three: 6:30PM - 8:10 PM

Post flight duties: 10 minutes
Van ride to hotel: 15 minutes

Arrival Time At Hotel: 8:35PM
------------------------------------------

DAY TWO
Wake Up Call: 5:00AM
Van Time: 5:45AM
Duty Begins 6:00AM

Leg One: 6:45AM - 8:15AM
*25 Minute breakfast break*
Leg Two: 9:00AM - 10:00AM
Leg Three: 10:25AM - 11:25AM
Leg Four: 11:50AM - 1:00PM
*One hour sit*
Leg Five: 2:45PM - 4:00PM
*Two Hour Sit*
Leg Six: 6:30PM - 8:30PM

Post flight duties: 10 minutes
Van ride to hotel: 15 minutes

Arrival Time At Hotel: 8:55PM
-------------------------------------

DAY THREE
Wake Up Call: 4:55AM
Van Time: 5:40AM
Duty Begins 5:55AM

Leg One: 6:15AM - 8:20AM
Leg Two: 9:00AM - 10:20AM
*one hour sit*
Leg Three: 11:45AM - 1:00PM
*Two hour sit*
Leg Four: 3:20PM - 4:00PM
Leg Five: 4:30PM - 5:15PM
*One hour sit*
Leg Six: 6:30PM - 8:00PM

Post flight duties: 10 minutes
Van ride to hotel: 15 minutes

Arrival Time At Hotel: 8:25PM
----------------------------

DAY FOUR
Wake Up Call: 4:30AM
Van Time: 5:15AM
Duty Begins 5:30AM

Leg One: 6:00AM - 8:00AM
Leg Two: 8:25AM - 9:45AM
Leg Three: 10:15AM - 11:35AM
*one hour sit*
Leg Four: 1:00PM - 2:10PM
Leg Five: 2:30PM - 3:40PM

Duty Ends at 3:40.... Go HOME!!!!!!
-----------------------

Total "on duty" hours = 51 hours on duty this week
Total flight hours = Approx 27 hours
Total pay this trip = $618

but it feels like you are making just over $12/hour when you consider the 51 hour duty period. as schedules vary throughout the year, your end of the year break down of flight pay versus on duty time might come to as little as $7.00 per hour  :o

i told someone the other day, "the work can be very difficult. you can be shooting approaches to minimums in heavy rain, or dodging thunderstorms one day, or it will be as easy as sitting there playing flight sim the next day."

If i had it all to do over again, i would have probably picked a grounded / stable career and flown for a hobby on MY terms... thats probably the best advice i can give to anyone wanting to be an airline pilot, but not everyone will be able to take that advice, a lot of people have to see for themselves...

... thats where our 60 resignations a month come in to play  :-/

Yes... there are pilots out there who earn 150K annaully flying the 777 from new york to london, but they are usually 55 years old, and have suffered through 25 years of crummy flying jobs to get there... thats what most folks are unable to do... 25 years of earning less than 30- 50K annually

[RitterKreuz]

in addition to the above post i will add the following in relation to vodka burners link to that thread about simming.

if you want a real airline sim experience do this:

(if you have a good 4 day weekend, or you are a student on spring or summer break)

Day One

Start playing flight simulator around noon and choose a regional jet or twin turboprop. turn the volume on your PC to a "believable" noise level.

fly 6 legs per day, with an hour break once or sometimes twice per day.

your last flight should always end around 8:30 - 9:00PM

wake up around 5:00am... get a shower and get cleaned up as you would for a work day, and eat a bran muffin and a cup of coffee for breakfast.

your first flight should always start at around 6:00am (dont forget to show up at the sim 30 minutes before departure)

dont schedule your next break until at least 1:00 or 2:00 PM

repeat this process for 4 or 5 days.

[Xyn_Air]

RK,

Thanks so very much for your very informative posts!  That was some interesting reading.  Believe it or not, I have some free-time in the not-too distant future, so I may give your "simulation" suggestion a go.  Remind me, sometime, to tell you about a teaching "simulation" idea I have.  ;D

As for the pay you received for your four-day duty period, that really surprised me (which seems to be by usual reaction for this thread).  Roughly, you make the same as I do.  Whoa.  Maybe I will stop feeling bummed out by not having tried to become a commercial pilot!  I mean, the job sounds as fascinating as ever, but it doesn't seem like the gold mine I perhaps once thought it was.

Maybe you can answer these questions, then:

1) When you got into commercial aviation, were you fairly aware of the pay scale, or did that come as a surprise to you?

2) Do you find personal enjoyment of your job to make up for tighter wages than one might expect?  For example, I would love to continue teaching, even if it meant less wages (sigh . . . clock ticking on that contract), simply because I feel so passionately about working in education.

3) The four-day jaunt you mentioned above, how often do you make such a trip?  Once-a-week?  Only a couple times a month?

Thanks for all the information you have provided.  And thanks to everyone else who has helped make this a more lively thread than I imagined!

All the best,
Darrin

[RitterKreuz]

well sadly ill have to give you the semi-long answer to question one:

Large flight schools base their advertising strategy on leading you to believe that pilots make a lot of money. how they get away with it is pretty much the fault of how airline salaries are reported in statistics combined with misinformation.

On the bright sunny day when i sprang up in my chair and said "ok thats it! im going to do it! im going to be an airline pilot." well.... times were different. there was a hiring boom going on, and events like September 11th were not even in the darkest wildest nightmares of passengers and pilots alike.

things are different now, but back then it seems easy to say "ok i think i can survive a few years of low pay" but the reality of it is that demand changes... the economy changes... oil prices change, and as all of these things change (virtually every day) so does the likelihood that you will advance within the company. so the "few years of low pay" can easily turn into a decade or more.

QUESTION TWO:

I do really enjoy my job. The people i work with are "A number one!" in my book. I enjoy the way kids come visit the cockpit before push back because i can remember once that I was that kid. I get to see and do a lot of things that most people live their entire lifetimes dreaming of. for that i am lucky.

BUT!!! (you knew that was coming) i dont feel like im paid what im worth. i transport approximately 50,000 to 60,000 passengers per year, and im paid at a rate of about 35-40 cents per person.

its important for me to enjoy what i do for a living... but on the same note, i have to be able to pay for my bills. between my wife and I both working, after paying for the electric, gas, water and cable bill, phone bill, 2 cars and insurance for said cars... there is quite literally nothing left. at this point i cant save for retirement or set aside money for much of anything.

QUESTION THREE:

this trip sequence is a 4 ON 3 OFF schedule, so once that 4 day trip is completed i get three days off. with my seniority that translates to working Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday and Thursday... and having Friday Saturday and Sunday off. Keep in mind that i spend most of Friday sleeping.  :-/

basically every MON - THUR i go do the same trip for a month, then bid something else for the next month.

[beaky]

in addition to the above post i will add the following in relation to vodka burners link to that thread about simming.

if you want a real airline sim experience do this:

(if you have a good 4 day weekend, or you are a student on spring or summer break)

Day One

Start playing flight simulator around noon and choose a regional jet or twin turboprop. turn the volume on your PC to a "believable" noise level.

fly 6 legs per day, with an hour break once or sometimes twice per day.

your last flight should always end around 8:30 - 9:00PM

wake up around 5:00am... get a shower and get cleaned up as you would for a work day, and eat a bran muffin and a cup of coffee for breakfast.

your first flight should always start at around 6:00am (dont forget to show up at the sim 30 minutes before departure)

dont schedule your next break until at least 1:00 or 2:00 PM

repeat this process for 4 or 5 days.

Don't forget:
"Sleep each night in a strange bed in a hotel room with itchy towels and very hard soap, next door to either the ice machine or the noisy honeymoon couple..."


I'm not an airline pilot but I know the hotel-room blues by heart...

[RitterKreuz]

;)

sounds like you do!

My top 10 worst hotel experiences so far on the job.

1. We were running behind all day due to weather, and our one hour break before the overnight leg was totally eaten into by delays, so i missed any chance of having dinner before the overnight. There was a small dominoes pizza next to the hotel and nothing else in walking distance so i dropped a few bills on a personal size pepperoni pizza gobbled it down and went to bed abour 10PM for a 5:00AM wake up call.

At about 1:00am i woke up with what i assumed was some sort of mild food poisoning... it subsided around 4:15am

2. Just when i got good and comfy i started getting eaten up by ants in the bed at one hotel.

3. Went to a hotel and got into the room, unpacked my uniform for the next day, got some clean night clothes on and then i hear a dog barking relentlessly from across the hall. someone had left it in there while they went out doing whatever. after about 20 minutes i repacked everything and changed rooms.

4. Took a shower at one hotel, reached out for a towel, and just as i was about to bury my face in the towel i noticed a big brown streak down the middle. dont know what it was... didnt hold on to the towel long enough to find out. STILL to this day i check the towels front and back.

5. woke up at about 2:30am with an unrelenting thirst. went to fill a glass with water and noticed it already had water in it with lipstick marks and the plastic cling wrap put back on it.  :-/ so i threw on some pants and went to the vending machine for a bottle of water.. floor one sold out, floor two sold out, floor three sold out, floor four sold out finally got lucky on the fifth floor.

6. countless times when the front desk mistakenly gave another guest MY room while i was trying to sleep.

7. One hotel i frequently visit is next to a big dance club, but it is not a problem unless its Thursday night and you get an east side room. screaming people and loud music until 2:30 am  >:(

8. another hotel i used to overnight a lot on a more junior schedule had a bit truck stop style gas station next door right outside the east side rooms. On certain nights every motorcycle in town from harley to crotch rocket would gather and have some sort of contest to see who could do the longest burn outs and whos engine could turn out the highest RPM

9. In Monroe, Louisiana at a particularly nasty hotel there was what was assumed to be a human turd in the middle of the hall way. could have been a dog turd but it was a little long and straight for that.

10. Alexandria, Louisiana there was a crack deal gone wrong outside the hotel where one person was shot and came into the hotel bleeding everywhere to call 911. police cars and police helicopter all over the place until about 2:00am

runner up#1: happened to another crew i know. Captain is fast asleep and someone shot a gun into his room through the window and into one of the walls.

Runner up #2: another crew i know left their rooms at 5:30am for the van to the airport and there was thick smoke in the hall way. the wing they were sleeping in had an inoperative smoke alarm system. checked out in the nick of time.

Runner up #3: happened to my Captain one month. 2:30Am a crying 4 year old child in the hall is beating on the captains door. finally the captain answered it. apparently the kid's father had left him in the room next door while he went to the hotel bar to drink. police and CPS were on the scene requesting statements from hotel staff and the captain... easily took an hour from his rest.

and dont count on crew scheduling to compensate you... your only hope is to call in fatigued if you feel safety is an issue

[Slotback]

Hey RK, facinating read, thanks for posting!

[RitterKreuz]

real life is not so exciting all the time.

there are several trips where all there is to do is sit there and converse, glancingly read a magazine or just listen to the engines hum.

the only exciting times are takeoff, landing and if something goes wrong... and you dont want things going wrong  ;D

[The Ruptured Duck]

One of my friends flew cargo in Commanders and worked line on his layover at Jabara.  Reason he didn't want to go to airlines:  paycut.

[RitterKreuz]

im passively looking for other options as far as a career path goes.

you would think that Part 121 airline pilots could instruct on the side or something but they cant. the FAA limits you to 1,000 hours per year, and the company makes you sign an agreement that the only commercial hours you will work are for them only.

you CAN get approval to instruct on the side, but usually only for one close friend or a family member.

its too risky IMHO to risk busting a regulation because of a little extra cash.

[Dr.bob7]

I read somewhere that the median earnings of all pilots was about 100k a year kinda odd with RJ pilots making up alot of that

besides that after your Job on a CRJ700 would you get put on something like a 737 or Airbus?

[RitterKreuz]

regionals operate CRJs and the like, not heavy stuff.

if you want to get to an airbus or a 737 or a 777 you must get hired by a company that operates them...

... in order to get hired the airlines must be hiring and you have to meet their requirments. (theres the rub)

You might spend 10 years on a CRJ waiting for that 737 job, but by the time you get hired you are earning 70K a year and would take a pay cut of about 30K a year to start all over at "zero" with another company.