This will get ugly

Real aviation things here. News, items of interest, information, questions, etc!

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Craig. » Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:33 pm

LOL i dont think this is what Ozzy meant when he titled it "this will get ugly" ;D

As we were the only approved supplier of Concorde wheel bearings they were forced to. I rather liked that.
That is pretty cool.
As for the
User avatar
Craig.
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 15569
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2002 10:04 am
Location: Birmingham

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Hagar » Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:43 pm

[quote]I honestly think Branson realised right at the start he both couldnt afford the plane, and wouldnt be given it. He tried to make BA look bad by then bringing up the
Last edited by Hagar on Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Image

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group
My Google Photos albums
My Flickr albums
User avatar
Hagar
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 30864
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:15 am
Location: Costa Geriatrica

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Craig. » Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:56 pm

LOL again, i have no personal feelings for Richard Branson the person, yes i hear these stories about him being very friendly, i know a couple of people who sent letters to Virgin expecting to get some typed reply from an office miles away from Branson, only to get a handwritten letter from Branson himself, along with an autographed picture and a few other press pack type goodies. From that point of view i have to say yes he can be a nice guy( slightly backtracking i know:)) and yes somethings he does in business are the sort of thing you wouldnt see from anyone else. But its also that which bothers me about him as a businessman. Recently Virgin started the UK to Australia routes via hong kong( maybe Singapore), now to begin with, Branson sent out a challenge to the head of QANTAS saying that if he got the route, the guy incharge of QANTAS would have to work the inaugural flight as a flight attendant dressed in a females uniform, and if he didnt, he would work a QANTAS flight in the same manner. Hardly the sort of actions the head of a company should be partaking in, all in fun i know but again he knew it wouldnt be accepted, i would be interested in seeing Branson making a challenge that he would stand a chance of loosing, would he be a man and honor his word? Add to that on the first flight to Australia when they landed he paraded about on the elevators on the back of the A340 with a pair of girls dressed in bikinis while holding a surfboard.
Last edited by Craig. on Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
Craig.
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 15569
Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2002 10:04 am
Location: Birmingham

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Hagar » Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:18 pm

Nothing wrong with a little fun. A sense of humour helps a great deal in business. In fact I would probably have suffered a nervous breakdown without mine.
Image

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group
My Google Photos albums
My Flickr albums
User avatar
Hagar
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 30864
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:15 am
Location: Costa Geriatrica

Re: This will get ugly

Postby TacitBlue » Thu Dec 16, 2004 8:29 pm

I hope somebody builds another supersonic airliner. I always saw Concorde as my only chance to experience moving faster than sound, sense Im not a fighter pilot.
Image
A&P Mechanic, Rankin Aircraft 78Y

Aircraft are naturally beautiful because form follows function. -TB
User avatar
TacitBlue
Major
Major
 
Posts: 3856
Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2004 12:33 pm
Location: Saint Joseph, Missouri, USA

Re: This will get ugly

Postby forfun » Fri Dec 17, 2004 12:05 am

I think Branson is as good a businessman as Bill Gates. That doesnt mean he's a nice person, or is nice to people, or even does business cleanly. It just means that he is a clever businessman who knows how to deal with things and get other people to do what he wants. That is why he is so succesful. Morals these days are not tolorated if you are to do well in making money.

These days, a good businessman does not have to be nice or generous, they have to be bold and ruthless, it's a sad fact but it's true.
Now if something goes without saying, then why do people say it??

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/04fs/MP/9320.jpg
forfun
2nd Lieutenant
2nd Lieutenant
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:38 pm

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Hagar » Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:36 am

These days, a good businessman does not have to be nice or generous, they have to be bold and ruthless, it's a sad fact but it's true.

This is quite true. To succeed in business you have to be quite ruthless. This does not mean that you have to be an unpleasant person or treat your employees badly. The man I worked for until recently is one of the nicest people you could ever wish to meet. He is one of the most successful businessmen I know & can be quite ruthless if need be. I don't think anyone is in a position to criticise Richard Branson or anyone else unless they have met them, worked for them or done business with them to see what they are really like.
Image

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group
My Google Photos albums
My Flickr albums
User avatar
Hagar
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 30864
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:15 am
Location: Costa Geriatrica

Re: This will get ugly

Postby forfun » Fri Dec 17, 2004 3:51 am

I don't think anyone is in a position to criticise Richard Branson or anyone else unless they have met them, worked for them or done business with them to see what they are really like

Good point. I watched a television show on the airline Pacific Blue and he flew all the way down to New Zealand to meet the flight attendants and crew.
Now if something goes without saying, then why do people say it??

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/04fs/MP/9320.jpg
forfun
2nd Lieutenant
2nd Lieutenant
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:38 pm

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Hagar » Fri Dec 17, 2004 4:08 am

I hope somebody builds another supersonic airliner. I always saw Concorde as my only chance to experience moving faster than sound, sense Im not a fighter pilot.

I'm not sure a supersonic airliner will ever be practical or necessary for the ordinary travelling public. Even in the heyday of Concorde the worst hold-ups were at airports or travelling to & from them.

I was fortunate enough to break the "sound barrier" back in 1959 when it was quite an achievement. While this was obviously exciting for a 16 year-old boy, exceeding the speed of sound itself was really quite disappointing & nothing like I had imagined. The only way to tell we had done it was to look at the machmeter. My brother confirmed the same thing when traveliing twice as fast on Concorde.
Image

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group
My Google Photos albums
My Flickr albums
User avatar
Hagar
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 30864
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:15 am
Location: Costa Geriatrica

Re: This will get ugly

Postby forfun » Fri Dec 17, 2004 4:13 am

The only way to tell we had done it was to look at the machmeter

Well, the body can withstand speeds unimaginable. It's getting to that speed and slowing down from it that affects humans. I would say you woulda accelerated to the speed of sound quite slowly (seeing it was 1959!!) and you wouldn't of noticed. Didn't you feel the sonic boom though?
Now if something goes without saying, then why do people say it??

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/04fs/MP/9320.jpg
forfun
2nd Lieutenant
2nd Lieutenant
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:38 pm

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Hagar » Fri Dec 17, 2004 4:26 am

Well, the body can withstand speeds unimaginable. It's getting to that speed and slowing down from it that affects humans. I would say you woulda accelerated to the speed of sound quite slowly (seeing it was 1959!!) and you wouldn't of noticed.

I don't think the date has anything to do with it. The aircraft was a RAF Hawker Hunter T.7 advanced trainer & like the Hunter front line fighters it was only capable of exceeding Mach 1 in a dive. In my case this was almost vertical & the best part about it.

Didn't you feel the sonic boom though?
No & nor does anyone else. This is a common fallacy. The sound waves are ahead & behind the aircraft. The only people to hear or feel anything would be miles away from the aircraft itself & usually on the ground.
Image

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group
My Google Photos albums
My Flickr albums
User avatar
Hagar
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 30864
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:15 am
Location: Costa Geriatrica

Re: This will get ugly

Postby forfun » Fri Dec 17, 2004 4:30 am



No & nor does anyone else. This is a common fallacy. The sound waves are ahead & behind the aircraft. The only people to hear or feel anything would be miles away from the aircraft itself & usually on the ground.

Really?, You learn something everyday
Now if something goes without saying, then why do people say it??

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/04fs/MP/9320.jpg
forfun
2nd Lieutenant
2nd Lieutenant
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:38 pm

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Hagar » Fri Dec 17, 2004 4:40 am

Really?, You learn something everyday

Really. Read this. http://www.nasaexplores.com/show2_articlea.php?id=02-001

PS. The photo is of an F-18 travelling at Mach 1.4, an altitude of 35,000 feet.
Image

Bow shock on supersonic wedge airfoil, M = 1.7
Image
Last edited by Hagar on Fri Dec 17, 2004 5:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
Image

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group
My Google Photos albums
My Flickr albums
User avatar
Hagar
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 30864
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:15 am
Location: Costa Geriatrica

Re: This will get ugly

Postby forfun » Fri Dec 17, 2004 5:48 am

I don't think the date has anything to do with it. The aircraft was a RAF Hawker Hunter T.7 advanced trainer & like the Hunter front line fighters it was only capable of exceeding Mach 1 in a dive. In my case this was almost vertical & the best part about it.


How high were you at the time?
Now if something goes without saying, then why do people say it??

http://www.homepages.mcb.net/bones/04fs/MP/9320.jpg
forfun
2nd Lieutenant
2nd Lieutenant
 
Posts: 214
Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:38 pm

Re: This will get ugly

Postby Hagar » Fri Dec 17, 2004 6:18 am

How high were you at the time?

This was many years ago but I can remember it as if it were yesterday. We started the dive at 43,000 feet & pulled out at 20,000. Then we climbed back up & did it again. Magic. ;)

I had a better illustration of the sonic boom but I've lost it. If I find it I'll post it here.

PS. I found it. Play the applet at the bottom of this page. http://www.phy.ntnu.edu.tw/java/airplane/airplane.html
Last edited by Hagar on Fri Dec 17, 2004 6:46 am, edited 1 time in total.
Image

Founder & Sole Member - Grumpy's Over the Hill Club for Veteran Virtual Aviators
Member of the Fox Four Group
My Google Photos albums
My Flickr albums
User avatar
Hagar
Colonel
Colonel
 
Posts: 30864
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:15 am
Location: Costa Geriatrica

PreviousNext

Return to Real Aviation

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 463 guests