Before pushing back.

[JVC_systems]

That's intersting, where did you guys see that video? Was it on the net? And I was wondering if there are any 727 left in commercial service since scottB727 mentioned that he is 727 pilot. I thought all 727 have been retired from commercial service, well at least most of them

[scottB727]

Loomex I'm sure you're right about that.  But I hate to hear these urban myths propagated by smart people who, if they really thought about it would know there is no way from some of the ludicrous things to happen.  I also know there is curiosity out there as to how big jets are operated and to the extent I can I don't mind pitching in.  One of these days I'll organize my own dumb questions that I have about this sim stuff....

Scott

[scottB727]

There are hundreds of 727's left in the "commercial" fleet.  The passenger carriers are retiring them in favor of more fuel efficient a/c but the cargo carriers still use them because they are cheap, reliable and carry a significant payload.

Scott

[Craig.]

pretty much the same for the DC10 and MD11 Just a shame the beautiful tri-jet is slowly leaving airline service.

[scottB727]

Maybe that's so for the DC10 but the MD11 is a new generation airplane and the reasons for getting rid of those are different than aging aircraft reasons.  

[Craig.]

well yeah i know that:) but its still going sadly.

[Craig.]

hey scott. Dont know if you mind me asking, but why does the 727 seem to take forever to take off? I have watched a few of them in atlanta when i was there and also have been on one, they seem to hold onto the runway for along time, yet make so much noise you'd think it would rocket off. Or was it just pilots choice???

[scottB727]

The 727 is at best a 20 year old airplane using 30 yr old technology.  The engine design of the 60s is significantly diff than modern jet engines.  You might notice the size of the inlet of older jets like the JT8D that the 727 has and any of the high bypass fans on newer airplanes.  These newer designs produce much more thrust with less noise and weight.  The airplanes are also built of lighter materials for the same size wing (roughly).  There are also several diff airframe and engine combinations on the 727 the worst case is the stretch with the smallest engines which is a real ground hugger, then Boeing came up with the 727 Advanced which has larger engines and significantly higher weights/performance.

Scott

[JVC_systems]

What about the video? Where did you guys see it? Also, Have you seen Tupolev Tu-154? It looks very identical to Boeing 727. I have been on both, Tupolev Tu-154 and Boeing 727 and interior of both aircrafts is very similar too. I was wondering, did Boeing copy 727 from Tupolev or did Tupolev copy 727 or is it just the way both companies wanted their aircraft to look? Also what are the differences between those two jet?

P.S.
Personally I like Tu-154 more than 727 partly because I have flown on it more often than on a 727 and also the design of the aircraft is a bit nicer than on 727 althought very similar.

[scottB727]

JVC I'm sure that there are people who would prefer a Lada to a Cadilac as well...  :)

[scottB727]

A quick internet search reveals the TU-154 entered service in 1972 the 727 in 1964.  I'll leave it up to you to decide if one was copied from the other...  But you might consider the DC3 and the "russian" version  LI-2.

If it's not a boeing I'm not going....

[OTTOL]

But I hate to hear these urban myths propagated by smart people who, if they really thought about it would know there is no way from some of the ludicrous things to happen.  I also know there is curiosity out there as to how big jets are operated and to the extent I can I don't mind pitching in.  One of these days I'll organize my own dumb questions that I have about this sim stuff....

Scott

I don't believe the flight attendant story, period.  I have personally opened the main cabin door with the engines running it is not an issue with regard to being drawn towards the engine.  Take a look around next time you're at the airport, there all kinds of ground people walking around down below.  The door can't as a rule be opened when the cabin is still pressurized as they are plug type doors.  Even if you could get the door open the difference between the pressure inside and outside the cabin are not so different that you'd be "blown" out.

09 MAY 2001   The NTSB issues 6 safety recommendations regarding the Airbus A.300-600 pressurization system and evacuations, following the November 20, 2000 incident in which a flight attendant was killed during an emergency evacuation of an American Airlines A.300 at Miami. The airplane was pressurized until he opened the left front door (1L); he was then forcibly ejected from the airplane. (NTSB) http://aviation-safety.net/graphics/bdot.gif>

[scottB727]

Ottol, t's not clear to me from your cut and paste job whether the FA was ejected by pressurization or a slide.  I can tell you that I have never flown an airplane that would prepressurize (on the ground) to greater than .125 psig that is not much pressure though it is normally enought to keep the door closed....

I just checked on your find and if you read the entire report (if it's the same one)  this aircraft was experiencing pressurization problems this was not a normal situation that lead to the flight att being blown out.  If you back up and read the thread we were discussing the reasons behind closing the door before push back.  I think the answers I gave were peferctly legit. in that context.  It is a far different issue to have a runaway pressurization system and then to force the door out than to say the reason the engines are not started until after push is to prevent the FA from being blown out and sucked into the engine which was what I thought was being put foeward.

In any event I won't trouble you with my replies any further....  I'll keep my experience to myself...

Scott

[OTTOL]

Now, now, now..............first of all, it's Friday, so relax and enjoy the night.

I can tell you, that as a professional pilot, one of the first things that I learned when I started coming to this site is how to put my foot FIRMLY in my mouth! The reason that your response grabbed my attention was that I have personal experience with this case. The incident in question did NOT involve a slide. It was an A300-600 with a pressurization problem. The airbus, unlike the Boeing(and I'm sure you'll be glad to hear this)has doors which do NOT open in. The flight attendant opened the door(per procedure)and WAS ejected from the aircraft. You ARE correct, the PD is very low, but in this case, a 140lb male F/A is launched much more quickly than a 500# cabin door. The result should be obvious. Something akin to a human watermelon seed! The 20foot drop to the ground afterwords, probably didn't help his odds either!
I realize exactly where this thread started, but you DID state that you didn't believe the story. Well, there you go!

  Remember, one of the jokes around here is, that if you give a thread enough time, it usually degrades to the subject of FOOD. So I apologize, if you feel like you were attacked. It was not my intent. Keep the comments coming, it's nice to see a new face around here.  8)

[JVC_systems]

I am not very familiar with all that stuff about cabin pressure so I can't really say anything. I just heared people say it is better not to open the door right away, and that's pretty much all I know about that.

scottB727,
I was wondering what you think of Tu-154. When you said  "JVC I'm sure that there are people who would prefer a Lada to a Cadilac as well...  " the first thing I thought it is that you are on B727 side . That's alright. What's wrong with Tu-154 thought? I think it's a nice jet too  :)