Isnt it ashame...............

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Re: Isnt it ashame...............

Postby Stormtropper » Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:51 pm

Cause of crash...
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...NOT ATC...
Arizona State University
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Re: Isnt it ashame...............

Postby Mobius » Tue Jul 17, 2007 5:56 pm

ATC did say "go-around", but the student never acknowledged it or the clearance to pattern altitude (circuit height), and ATC never repeated it, so it looks as though ATC might have some fault in it now, but I am by no means the judge and jury.

Looking at the transcript (only the part Charlie posted), in my opinion, ATC should have restated the order to go around and climb until the student acknowledged it.  Not to mention, at that point in the approach, the tower should have had visual contact with the aircraft, so they should have been able to see both visually and with radar (if he was still in radar contact) that he wasn't climbing.  It's easy for me to sit and say this is what should have been done, blah, blah, blah, but we weren't there, in that particular situation, so it's difficult to say what actually happened, and since none of us were there, I don't think any of us can say exactly what happened or what should have been done.


Still, it's a terrible accident, and the student should be commended for avoiding people on the ground.
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Re: Isnt it ashame...............

Postby C » Wed Jul 18, 2007 3:45 am

Cause of crash...
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...NOT ATC...


Read the report and you'll note that ATC weren't blamed - the point isn't apportioning blame - the point is picking out where "mistakes" were made, and how they can be avoided in future, so this doesn't happen to another 16 year old, or 43 year old or whatever. Ultimately it was the student lost control of the aeroplane as he attempted to fly with an abnormal configuration and low power setting.

However, if things had been done differently by those on the ground (not just ATC) then it probably would not have happened. Hence all the recommendations at the end of the report - mostly relating to the way ATC handle and know about inexperienced students, and maybe in future the flying club will have an instructor in the tower next to the aerodrome controller in future when solos are airborne - a quick intervention from him may have saved the day.

ATC did say "go-around", but the student never acknowledged it or the clearance to pattern altitude (circuit height), and ATC never repeated it


Exactly - I'm glad you've seen my point, that with such an inexperienced student there was no definitive order to go around - only the one mention in a long tranmission. Even now with several hundred hours, a non standard transmission, particularly if a controller has an accent of any sorts, it can be difficult to take all the information in.
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