**HS dist 214 proposed book ban, Need Opinions**

[legoalex2000]

here's as many articles as i could find on the subject at hand.

http://www.dailyherald.com/story.asp?id=192761
http://cbs2chicago.com/topstories/local ... 24416.html
http://www.suntimes.com/output/news/cst ... ban22.html
http://www.pioneerlocal.com/cgi-bin/ppo ... 31782.html


more news expected in the morning, vote to be cast after public hearing

The ban was rejected!!!

http://www.nbc5.com/education/9278382/d ... i&psp=news

Here's the idea. Dist 214 member Leslie Pinney wants to ban several books on the basis of being "pornographic, violent, racist, etc..."

this is the 2nd largest district in Illinois (under Chicago) and it affects these schools (for those who have heard of them)

Buffalo Grove
John Hersey
Wheeling
Prospect
Rolling Meadows - mine
Elk Grove

they expected 300-400 people there, they got 1,500. and only 400 of them had recieved tags to go up to the podium to speak (i was #307, but i left and im home now) as of right now they are on 150 (thanks to inside sources) and it's been well over 2 hours.

here are the books o the proposed ban list:
"The Awakening"
"The Perks of Being a Wallflower"
"Freakonomics"
"How Garcia Girls Lost Their Accents"
"Fallen Angels"
"The Botany of Desire: A Plant's Eye View"
"Slaughterhouse-Five"
"Beloved"

now because of this, and i heard the first 70 speakers, i plan to buy a couple of these books to read what they are about

here's the big reason that sparked this debate. Pinney has only read 2 of these books, and is basing the rest of her judgement on excepts, mostly the graphic ones. She is a conservative Christian who sends her kids to private schools. She stated (i quote) "I'm glad i send my kids to a private school where i know they will recieve a proper education" then later stated "I could never send my kids to a public school like these"

She stated in 2005 that "'m going to put my christian Beliefs in my decision making process for this district"

now as far as I know, Illinois had the biggest heated debate about Separation between Church & state. She is thrown into the wildfire, doing the exact opposite.

who voted her and why? i just got my voter's registration card, i'm voting her out next term (in 2007)

Now i know the Superintendent Personally and I know he is against banning these books.

I need opinions from everywhere. i can get this published in the school newspaper (so a least there is some impact from around the world)

thanks all!

Ramos

[beefhole]

Yeah, I read the first article you put up-it said she "vowed to bring her christian beliefs into the boardroom" and I thought, "so wait, who the hell voted for her then?"

Madness.  I have a lot to say about this, but, of course, it's inappropriate for this board.  *double sigh*

Suffice to say that short of hardcore pornos, (which high schoolers can attain themselves as independent reading thankyou very much!) there should never be any book bannings.

[Sir_Crashalot]

To ban books. Hmmm. Didn't the nazis do something similar during WWII?

Crash

[ozzy72]

I think they burnt them!
I feel that people should keep their personal beliefs to themselves. Sure share them in private by all means but trying to push them on others is exactly what people like the Nazis and Communists and many other less than pleasant groups have done down through the ages. Every country in the world has been guilty of it at some time or another.
It is one step from banning books to shooting people for having differing beliefs... wait a minute aren't we doing that already?

[beefhole]

I think they burnt them!
I feel that people should keep their personal beliefs to themselves. Sure share them in private by all means but trying to push them on others is exactly what people like the Nazis and Communists and many other less than pleasant groups have done down through the ages. Every country in the world has been guilty of it at some time or another.
It is one step from banning books to shooting people for having differing beliefs... wait a minute aren't we doing that already?

What what what!? !?

An English teacher against book burning/banning?

*moans* my heart! *falls over*

[beaky]

What what what!? !?

An English teacher against book burning/banning?

*moans* my heart! *falls over*

Yes, it's appallling. Teachers are supposed to be on the front lines battling for free speech... after all, when totalitarianism descends, the academics are the first to be lined up against the wall.
Unless, of course, said academics have already forsaken their duty  and become mouthpieces for the ministers of propoganda...

As for what should be deemed inappropriate for schools, I don't  even have to see the list in this case to say I would not find any of the books pornographic, racist or violent. If the mere discussion or description of war, rape, murder, drunkeness, incest, fratricide, thievery, bigotry, and slavery is to be our yardstick for denying books to children, we should throw the Bible on the top of the bonfire, IMHO. Me, I don't have a problem with it... the word "free" in "free will" is the same "free" found in "freedom of the press", "Operation Enduring Freedom", and "Freedom Fries" (LOL). One's morality is made stronger by challenges and temptations... plenty of Bible stories about that.

But I've read a few ofthese books:
Slaughterhouse 5 is a brilliant observation on war (probably thought of in this case as being unpatriotic, because it's about American POWs trapped in Dresden during the Allied bombing of that city and is merely a fair appraisal and not jingoistic and one-sided);
Beloved (I only saw the movie) is steeped in the culture and language of the old segregated South and involves metaphysical stuff like demonic possession, but is a powerful story where good prevails (very Biblical in flavor; maybe that's the problem, who knows);
and The Botany of Desire, which i read recently, taught me more about plants than I ever learned in school. The furor over that book might be due to the fact that it has a whole chapter devoted to- gasp!- cannabis sativa. The author simply discusses its history as a fiber crop and mood-altering plant, and admits-horrors!- that out of scientific curiosity he once smoked pot. I can see why some would be alarmed, and it's too bad- it's a brilliant book. The chapter about the history of the apple is fascinating, and in the end, the author makes no endorsement of pot-smoking: on the contrary, he points out that most of the stuff on the street today is potentially more harmful than what the earliest users of the plant were smoking, and as for his own experiment, he didn't care for it.  Maybe this teacher felt he should have stuck with "Drugs Bad!! Evil, evil! You'll roast in Hell!" instead of being honest about it so the kids could decide for themselves.

This woman quoted earlier seems not so much a good Christian to me as a silly, handwringing biddy... the type who thinks that the best way to make children morally upstanding is to deny them opportunities to make moral choices... ::P

This reminds me of the  reason why discussion of politics and religion is frowned upon here (and yes, I know I'm on the verge; sorry)...
When you mix them: kaboom!!!

I'm sorry if I'm being too partisan about this; probably get this thread locked; but I'm worried about this country... very deeply worried.

[legoalex2000]

it was a heated debate, and a few other of my friends went up to speak.

all in all, the vote was 6-1, so despite our best efforts, she was still for baning these books. luckly the other 6 have the majority.

I'm gonna grab a copy of "The perks of being a wallflower" and "How the Garcia Girls lost their accents" and see what happens from there...

ramos

[Tweek]

She is a conservative Christian who sends her kids to private schools. She stated (i quote) "I'm glad i send my kids to a private school where i know they will recieve a proper education" then later stated "I could never send my kids to a public school like these"

That's what I hate. People sticking their nose in where it's not wanted.

There's some nasty, evil, horrible books at some of these public schools. You're children don't go to these schools. Excellent. Everybody wins.

She shouldn't be imposing religious beliefs anyway. Not everyone is a Christian. Religion should be kept to yourself and within your religious group. Their your beliefs, not everyone elses.

(Sorry if that sounded like a religious post. It wasn't meant to be, but I'm just trying to get a point across.)

[Hagar]

I haven't read any of these books so can make no personal comment, except that I'm against censorship in general. I found an interesting article on the subject of book banning here. http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/banned-books.html

This seems to apply nicely to this topic.

Unfit for Schools and Minors?

The Savannah Morning News reported in November 1999 that a teacher at the Windsor Forest High School required seniors to obtain permission slips before they could read Hamlet, Macbeth, or King Lear. The teacher's school board had pulled the books from class reading lists, citing "adult language" and references to sex and violence. Many students and parents protested the school's board's policy, which also included the outright banning of three other books. Shakespeare is no stranger to censorship: the Associated Press reported in March 1996 that Merrimack, NH schools had pulled Shakespeare's Twelfth Night from the curriculum after the school board passed a "prohibition of alternative lifestyle instruction" act. (Twelfth Night includes a number of romantic entanglements including a young woman who disguises herself as a boy.)

Readers from Merrimack informed me in 1999 that school board members who had passed the act had been voted out, after the uproar resulting from the act's passage, and that the play is now used again in Merrimack classrooms.

PS. These people never seem to learn that the more they protest, the more interest they promote in whatever they're protesting about. I imagine that all the books on that list will now become more popular than they ever were before.

[beaky]

I imagine that all the books on that list will now become more popular than they ever were before.

How true... the best way to get kids to do anything is to tell them nothing about it except that it's forbidden...

[beaky]

That's what I hate. People sticking their nose in where it's not wanted.

There's some nasty, evil, horrible books at some of these public schools. You're children don't go to these schools. Excellent. Everybody wins.

She shouldn't be imposing religious beliefs anyway. Not everyone is a Christian. Religion should be kept to yourself and within your religious group. Their your beliefs, not everyone elses.

(Sorry if that sounded like a religious post. It wasn't meant to be, but I'm just trying to get a point across.)

Another irony of this is that sending her kids to a cloistered school like that will probably not produce the results she's after. From what I've seen, it will likely go the other way.
By way of explanation, I will just say that the girl who taught me how to French-kiss was a Catholic schoolgirl (we were both around 14 at the time), and I'm sure she could have taught me a whole lot more if there had been an opportunity...

[ozzy72]

The only thing I've ever destroyed in school was a copy of the curriculum the boss gave me. I've never seen such a load of old twaddle in my life!
So I did everything my own particular way using my methods and my own material. Oddly enough I'm the only teacher who has NEVER had a student fail the language exam here (in 7 1/2 years).... maybe just maybe I'm doing it right
That said I would like to add that I'd happily burn most winners of the Nobel Prize for Literature if only for writing some of the most unreadable sh*t ever published! I would also nominate JK Rowling for a sainthood for getting kids to turn off the TV and read A lot of my students improved their English so they could read the more recent HPs 'cos it was taking over 6 months before the translation appeared! Thank you Joanne

[Hagar]

I would also nominate JK Rowling for a sainthood for getting kids to turn off the TV and read A lot of my students improved their English so they could read the more recent HPs 'cos it was taking over 6 months before the translation appeared! Thank you Joanne

I couldn't agree more as she's achieved a miracle. However, there are plenty of misguided people that would like nothing more than to see her work banned - without reading one word of her books. http://www.educationworld.com/a_admin/admin/admin157.shtml

Wouldn't surprise me if Dist 214 member Leslie Pinney was one of them. It's a funny old world.

[MattNW]

I can't get the links to work so I can't see which books are needing to be banned now but as for my opinion I don't need to know that. I'm against banning any book period for whatever reasons cited.

Of course I've always been known as a radical. When the question of whether one theory or another should be taught it's my opinion that all theories be presented and let the students believe what they may. Anything other than that is propaganda not education.

I guess that's the reason I never learned much from school after 6th grade. I just hit the librarys and figured it out on my own.

[Mushroom_Farmer]

There was a group in Indianapolis that recently tried to ban a school play of Ragtime. Thankfully, the school held it's ground and the play went on as scheduled.
I don't get how some people think students in their latter, maturing years should be sheltered from the realities of society. It's no wonder so many of of them fail, go nuts, or simply break down when thrown into the "real world".