The Bible?

[beaky]

Remember, guys, that if we'd like to chew the theological fat with another member, we can PM them...
but let's keep it civilized there, too.

[F-16Viper]

The New International Version (NIV) would be a good choice. Widely used today. Not sure about the Quran, as I am Presbyterian.

Defenatly not NIV. KJV was the 1st translation from the origanal language to english.

[Hagar]

KJV was the 1st translation from the origanal language to english.

Not the first by a long chalk.

By the time the King James Version was written, there was already a tradition going back almost a hundred years of Bible translation into English (not counting the Old English Bible translations that had been made in the Early Middle Ages, before the Roman Catholic Church started mandating the exclusive use of the Latin Vulgate). Many of the vernacular translations of the time were said to be filled with "heretical" translations and notes and were thus banned by the Church.

The King James Bible represents a revision of Tyndale's translation. When his New Testament appeared in 1525, Tyndale was a "Lutheran" to the extent that denominational labels had meaning in 1525, in other words, a supporter of Luther's movement to reform the whole Christian community.

You can read the complete King James Bible here. http://king-james-bible.classic-literature.co.uk/

[H]

...KJV was the 1st translation from the original language to English.

Not the first by a long chalk.

To lengthen Doug's chalkline, not  quite.

Quote:
...The King James Bible represents a revision of Tyndale's translation. When his New Testament appeared in 1525, Tyndale was a "Lutheran" to the extent that denominational labels had meaning in 1525, in other words, a supporter of Luther's movement to reform the whole Christian community.

However, this is not quite true. Approximately 80% percent of the original King James Version (1611) is from the so-named Tyndale Bible which included all of Tyndale's translation of the New Testament. Of the Old Testament, Tyndale, himself, is likely to have translated the Pentateuch and the Book of Jonah while the Book of Isaiah was translated by George Joye. Tyndale (martyred as a heretic on 6 October, 1536) also made 3 revised editions of his 1525 (English) New Testament in the 3 years previous to his demise.
However, the 1st complete English Bible known was the Wycliff Version, @ 1400. The Coverdale Bible appeared @1536, the Cranmere Bible in 1537, The Great Bible in 1539, the Geneva Bible in 1560, the Anglican Church wanted one of their own and produced the Bishop's Bible @1571; finally, the Catholics succumbed to an English translation, the Douay Bible from 1582 (New Testament) to 1609 (Old Testament). Next came something titled, "The Holy Bible, conteyning the Old Testament and the New; Newly Translated out of the Originall tongues, with the former Translations diligently compared and revised, by His Majesties speciall commandment. Appointed to be read in churches. Imprinted at London by Robert Barker, Printer to the Kings most Excellent Majestie. Anno Dom. 1611. cum Privilegio." (look at this precursor - and Doug accuses Americanese to have perverted English! )  The title given has been shortened to the King James Version.

[Chris_F]

I have very little knowledge of either book (bible or Koran).  But I am an outsider to both religions.  As an ignorant American I have exposure to Christians and Christianity but none to Muslims.  With Christians I find it fascinating that so very few of them have read all or parts of the bible.  Perhaps this is just a reflection of the tradition of that religon's followers to rely on church officials for interpretation of divine guidelines.

Since you're looking at both of these texts I assume it is in an attempt to gain some insight in to a currently very intense interaction between the two groups (Muslims and Christians).  Therefore I recommend you seek out translations and printings not by their accuracy to some original text but instead for their cultural and historical significance.

For example, if most Christians are protestants and most protestants reference the King James Bible then the King James would be a good choice since it will most accurately reflect the vision of the bible that this large body of people have.

Although since so few Christians read the bible then perhaps the concept of reading the bible to gain insight in to them isn't the most appropriate way.  In that case perhaps it best to instead focus on the writings of various church leaders, to better understand how the text is being interpreted and communicated to the followers of that faith.  If Sunday sermons are the means by which most Christians learn about their faith then this would be a more valid route to that end.

So I really think it comes down to the intent of your study.  Do you want to learn about the books themselves?  Then certainly the advice given here is better than mine.  Do you want to learn about the religons?  Then perhaps books on the history of the two religons are more appropriate.  Do you want to learn about the followers?  Then perhaps your best bet would be to visit local churches and mosques and get to know the people themselves.

[ozzy72]

If you really wanted to hear a good theological debate you should have been at the beer festival with me yesterday!
I was with a Syrian Muslim friend, a German Jewish friend and several Catholic Hungarians.
The Muslim and Jewish minorities decided the Catholics needed a good kickin' 'cos we took the longest to collect a round of beers Sounds fair to me... oh wait I'm a Catholic

[TacitBlue]

I was with a Syrian Muslim friend, a German Jewish friend and several Catholic Hungarians.

Did you guys all walk into a bar together?

[commoner]

If you really wanted to hear a good theological debate you should have been at the beer festival with me yesterday!
I was with a Syrian Muslim friend, a German Jewish friend and several Catholic Hungarians.
The Muslim and Jewish minorities decided the Catholics needed a good kickin' 'cos we took the longest to collect a round of beers Sounds fair to me... oh wait I'm a Catholic

.....lol..this side of the great Atlantic the jokes usually start with..." there was an Englishman, a Scotsman and an Irishman...etc ..etc.......well, your version is different I must admit..............commoner

[ozzy72]

Honestly this is just my life... I'm pleased to say the missus is now talking to me like a member of the human race again after a days hard physical labour as punishment for my coming home more than a little squiffy last night!
Why is it women don't find their husbands getting properly drunk once a year funny? I mean what chance did I stand? The beer is 15p a pint and I'd been doing some work at a friends beforehand and knocked back a few drinks....

[commoner]

Why is it women don't find their husbands getting properly drunk once a year funny? I mean what chance did I stand? The beer is 15p a pint and I'd been doing some work at a friends beforehand and knocked back a few drinks....

...yes but are you SURE that is just once a year?............mine is still talking to me after a dozen or so episodes, but after that I get "the treatment"...............not nice is it?..............they don't appreciate us do they that's the thing that really hurts..................commoner

[H]

..this side of the great Atlantic the jokes usually start with..." there was an Englishman, a Scotsman and an Irishman...etc ..etc.......well, your version is different I must admit..............commoner

A Muslim, a Jew and a Catholic went into a bar -- a huge steel one.
Not funny? Of course not -- it hurt like mad!

[Scorpiоn]

I have very little knowledge of either book (bible or Koran).  But I am an outsider to both religions.  As an ignorant American I have exposure to Christians and Christianity but none to Muslims.  With Christians I find it fascinating that so very few of them have read all or parts of the bible.  Perhaps this is just a reflection of the tradition of that religon's followers to rely on church officials for interpretation of divine guidelines.

Since you're looking at both of these texts I assume it is in an attempt to gain some insight in to a currently very intense interaction between the two groups (Muslims and Christians).  Therefore I recommend you seek out translations and printings not by their accuracy to some original text but instead for their cultural and historical significance.

For example, if most Christians are protestants and most protestants reference the King James Bible then the King James would be a good choice since it will most accurately reflect the vision of the bible that this large body of people have.

Although since so few Christians read the bible then perhaps the concept of reading the bible to gain insight in to them isn't the most appropriate way.  In that case perhaps it best to instead focus on the writings of various church leaders, to better understand how the text is being interpreted and communicated to the followers of that faith.  If Sunday sermons are the means by which most Christians learn about their faith then this would be a more valid route to that end.

So I really think it comes down to the intent of your study.  Do you want to learn about the books themselves?  Then certainly the advice given here is better than mine.  Do you want to learn about the religons?  Then perhaps books on the history of the two religons are more appropriate.  Do you want to learn about the followers?  Then perhaps your best bet would be to visit local churches and mosques and get to know the people themselves.

This exact thought crossed my mind, and it is why I asked here instead of looking it up in Wikipedia.  Basically whatever gets named the most is what I shall look into...

However, it was originally only the Quran that titillated my interest.  I threw in the bible for good measure.  It makes sense though, since the two well put together pie graphs I looked at indicated there are more Christians in the world.  I can't say I have a lot of genuine interest in the Bible in as much as the Quran, since when my parents forced me to Church as a child, they said all non-believers burn.  This included me.  The rest I shall not delve into.

[commoner]

since when my parents forced me to Church as a child, they said all non-believers burn.  This included me.  The rest I shall not delve into.

...well, they were almost right......We ALL burn, believers too, in the end..........unless you get yourself a 6x2 plot in some quiet corner............one way or t'other, it's ashes to ashes OR dust to dust..............commoner

[Scorpiоn]

...well, they were almost right......We ALL burn, believers too, in the end..........unless you get yourself a 6x2 plot in some quiet corner............one way or t'other, it's ashes to ashes OR dust to dust..............commoner

The prices are ungodly though!

PS: And the mortgage is an eternity!

[commoner]

The prices are ungodly though!

PS: And the mortgage is an eternity!

...LOL...wow! yes...forget the 6x2, think I'll just go for BURN!...........commoner