4 year old takes to the wheel.

[Hagar]

But although accidents will always happen, t0 they are much more likely to happen in an auto. The handbrake would be difficult for a tot to handle and rolling doesn't present too many dangers generally speaking. An auto will easily go 10 mph on the flat.

I don't follow your reasoning there Ben. For the vehicle to go anywhere the handbrake needs to be released. If it's on any sort of gradient it will roll even if it's not in gear. Makes no difference whether it's auto or manual. Most accidents with autos in this part of the world are caused by old fogeys confusing the brake & accelerator pedals. If they learned to drive properly using the method I previously explained this would be practially impossible.

[Saitek]

I didn't explain myself very well.

I meant, that in a manual there is not just the gears to get round with, but the handbrake. It is not easy to release as such and there is a technique involved in doing it. If then a child did somehow get it undone the furthest they could go is likely to be a roll even with the engine running due to the complication of the gears.
However in an auto, once you have the handbrake off you only have to push a lever and you don't roll you move at about 10mph. To add to that because autos have a 'park'  some people don't even use the handbrake - my parents never use it (:o) it is much easier for the child to get the car moving. There is a difference. The child couldn't have gone the same distance in a manual very easily.

[Hagar]

[quote]I didn't explain myself very well.

I meant, that in a manual there is not just the gears to get round with, but the handbrake. It is not easy to release as such and there is a technique involved in doing it. If then a child did somehow get it undone the furthest they could go is likely to be a roll even with the engine running due to the complication of the gears.
However in an auto, once you have the handbrake off you only have to push a lever and you don't roll you move at about 10mph. To add to that because autos have a 'park'

[cableguy]

It couldn't have happened in Britain, well it would be very unlikely because most cars are manuals. I take it this car is an automatic, like most cars in the US. Funny how its back to front there - and the US people drive on the wrong side of the road!

if you lived in US u would understand why most cars have automatic transmission.  Personally i prefer manual.  When I used to live in Belarus, my father taught me how to drive on manual when i was about 6 or 7.  But here in US, there is so much traffic, and the drivers are so terrible that manual is a mess.  you'll have to shift gears every 6 seconds. I drove manual here for like 6 months and arms just get tired.  you wont get higher then 3 thats for sure.    and if your first  gear is really short, like on Impreza, u are screwed

[eno]

Most American (automatic) cars, that I know of, and Mercedes (automatics) here in Europe do not have a Handbrake. They have a Parking brake which is activated by a separate pedal. The downfall of this is that if the car is left in the P position on the gear selector and this extra brake isn't activated, then the selector is easily moved to reverse and drive without having to do anything else.  There is no obvious physical sign untill the ignition is turned on that this brake is on as it's position can not be easily identified. With the more common HANDbrake  here in the UK it is not easily overlooked and the poisition it is left in is more obvious.

[cableguy]

u can do burnouts with the handbreak......

[Craig.]

Cable, Britain is actually awful for driving in the cities. If you want a real experiance Birmingham is about the best place you can drive. Between the never ending traffic jams, the drivers who insist on driving 20 mph above posted limits, and buses who completely ignore all other traffic, you have to have eyes in every corner of your head. It was the major reason i switched from learning manual to automatic.

[jimclarke]

Its amazing what some kids can do.  When my boy was four, he learned how to install computer games just by watching where I would point and click.  I had deleted some of his games because he was getting too emotional.  He would reinstall them.  Once I completely disconnected all the cables from his PC.  He hooked them all up and had it running again.  My wife was mad at me for making him obsessed with computer games (like father, like son ).  Once he was back in his room playing a miniature golf game and his golf balls were getting zapped and vaporized.  He was yelling, "This thing keeps hurting my balls!!"  That was so funny!!

Jim

[Hagar]

I think I'm right in saying that Eno is a professional driver so I'm in no position to argue. I've driven various types of automatic cars on visits to the US. My last visit was a few years ago so things might have changed since. The newest car I had was actually a brand new Toyota Corolla which had the conventional handrake. Others had various forms of foot-operated brake but they all had parking brakes of some sort.

As I said earlier, I never had a problem with automatics. In fact after driving that Toyota on holiday I couldn't wait to get one myself. As it turned out it wasn't a Toyota but I've now owned an automatic for almost 9 years. I could never go back to the stress of a manual gearbox. I can now drive for several hours without fatigue or the cramp I used to get from continually using the clutch pedal. I arrive fresh & ready to start what I drove all those miles for.

[Omag 2.0]

Eno is right, I recognize the extra pedal from my fathers Mercedes ( darn, why do all the old guys get the great cars?  :(  ;D) wich is an automatic aswell. I understand its practical use, especially in jams! Creeping forward at about 20 km/h ( sorry people, metric system only!  :P) for about 20 minutes can be hard. But when it comes to "real" driving, little roads, lots of turns, a manual is the thing for me. I enjoy the coordination it takes to release the gas, hit the clutch, change gear, release the clutch and add gaz in the correct almost simultanious way - and steer at the same time too.. However "older" ( excusez moi le mot) people tend to like an automatic more. I can see why, it kinda makes you drive more relaxed and slower.

Though an automatic corvette wouldn't hold me back...  ;D

[Hagar]

However "older" ( excusez moi le mot) people tend to like an automatic more. I can see why, it kinda makes you drive more relaxed and slower.

I'll go along with that except for the slow part. You obviously haven't seen my driving.

[C]

Most accidents with autos in this part of the world are caused by old fogeys confusing the brake & accelerator pedals. If they learned to drive properly using the method I previously explained this would be practially impossible.

I can vouch for you on that one...

I drive an automatic purely because it's less hassle and because a lot of the journeys I do involve long distances and motorways. Personally I think the world would be a lot safer if more people were to drive them, as there are a lot of people on the road who are barely safe driving them (too much for them to think about), much in the same way computerised flight systems have allowed the pilot not to have to worry about "flying the aeroplane".

Also the driving eye-test needs to be stricter, with progressive eye testing as a driver gets older. You'd be amazed at how little some people who are driving on the roads in the UK (legally) can see...

Charlie

[eno]

I think I'm right in saying that Eno is a professional driver so I'm in no position to argue. I've driven various types of automatic cars on visits to the US. My last visit was a few years ago so things might have changed since. The newest car I had was actually a brand new Toyota Corolla which had the conventional handrake. Others had various forms of foot-operated brake but they all had parking brakes of some sort.

Yup Doug .... professional driver ... Ive probably driven more miles backwards than most people drive forwards in their lives :D:D
The imports into the states tend to be more European in layout ... I should have made that clear.
The problem with automatics is their lack of engine braking and gear control. In the case of this thread .... if this had been a manual gearbox the car would have lurched forward and almost certainly stalled without any clutch input.

[Smoke2much]

I have 2 cars, an automatic 20 year old Volvo 240 GL and a 14 year old manual Clio.  I have only been driving for about 9 months and I have to say that the auto is extremely easy to drive in comparison with the manual but I much prefer the extra control that you feel with manual transmission.  

Will

[cableguy]

I enjoy the coordination it takes to release the gas, hit the clutch, change gear, release the clutch and add gaz in the correct almost simultanious way - and steer at the same time too

yep, thats what i like about manual.  driving and automatic gets kinda boring.  although it is much easier.  and yes manual is kinda hard to learn and operate, many drivers in US cant even drive automatic, some wouldnt even be able to drive if the car had only 1 gear.  The guy i know is a driving instructor, and he told me about this girl who was taking the lessons, and he was trying to explain to her that while she is driving whe should be able to predict what the car infront of her is about to do.  And her reply was " I dont even know what I AM about to do. "