IFR Flying Question

[reider]

Just do it the easy way mate, you can come back to all this stuff if and when you choose to get more technical er realistic with the flight sim.  Don`t be afraid to use the GPS, amongst other equipment the 747 has 2 GPS units in real life.  They don`t just fit them, switch them off and ignore them.  You do it the way you want and let the others talk shop and swap notes between themselves.

Reider

[Mobius]

Oh boy, this is getting interesting.  It's really up to jnigeld11 how he does it, the way actual instrument flying is done, or the easy/wrong way.  jnigeld11, if you actually want to learn to fly instruments, follow Brett's method.

[jnigeld11]

What a wealth of information here for us pilot "wannabees"! I'm going to try the 172 again IFR (I've already been informed that the 172 is what I will have to initially learn in anyway) and report back.

Rookie-Pilot-Nigel

[reider]

Not wrong, just the easy way only.  From Wilkipedia, on IFR Approaches

Navigation

Under IFR, the primary means of navigation is via radio beacons on the ground such as VORs and NDBs, although GPS is rapidly taking over.

Reider

[Mobius]

Not wrong, just the easy way only.  From Wilkipedia, on IFR Approaches

Navigation

Under IFR, the primary means of navigation is via radio beacons on the ground such as VORs and NDBs, although GPS is rapidly taking over.

Reider

Absolutely true, but I've got over thirteen hours of instrument flying, and my last lesson was the first time I ever flew an GPS approach.  The "old" instrument approaches really lay out the method for flying the GPS approaches.  If you actually flew the GPS approaches, you have to use approach plates for them as well.  I had to refer to the GPS plates just as much as I did the plates for VOR and ILS approaches.  Also take into consideration the fact that only until very recently, the GPS approach didn't have a glideslope, so only very new, very expensive aircraft can really rely on the GPS approach with a localizer and glideslope when there are no other approaches available.  I'm not saying the GPS approaches are bad, they're probably my favorite approach to fly, but they'd be made substantially more difficult if I hadn't flown any other approach before-hand.  It's never good to put all your eggs in one basket in aviation, especially when you're flying IFR.

[Brett_Henderson]

Not wrong, just the easy way only.  From Wilkipedia, on IFR Approaches

Quote:
Navigation

Under IFR, the primary means of navigation is via radio beacons on the ground such as VORs and NDBs, although GPS is rapidly taking over.

Reider

But see ?

[reider]

Im getting a bit frustrated now, so I guess it's time to ask for some guidance! Seems everytime I try an IFR flight, I can't make the approach for landing as I wind up way past the destination airport and so I disengage the autopilot and have to fly around to try and get back to some type of approach at the destination airport again. I follow all of ATC's instructions, but by the time I get the "established on the localizer" thing from ATC, I'm nowhere near the assigned runway approach at the destination airport. I have read various information concerning IFR, ATC, approach, etc and I think I'm employing the information correctly, but the same problem keeps happening. Is this a known issue with FSX at present or am I just an "Idiot Pilot"? any guidance or "flight lessons" would be much appreciated!

Regards,
VFR-for-now-Nigel

(1) Just to remind you, as you`ve gone way past what this user was asking, this is what he said.  Now adding more information is just going to confuse him all the more.  When he could take the easy approach and go into this in finite detail later.

(2) Nobody said not to use approach plates, several approaches to getting the info were mentioned, at no point did anyone mention not using them.

(3) 85% of the worlds pilots use GPS for both Approaches and ILS, that speaks bounds for the system.  Granted, both need to be learnt-I cannot argue with that-I will not say something is wrong or make things up to further what I`m saying, unlike some.  Its there, its widely used, people have a choice.

(4) Learning the full scope of approaches is good for you two and others, don`t try and force it down the throat of everyone else.  It does not make you look any better, nor does it make you a cut above anyone else.

(5) This user never asked how to make it realistic, I think if you read it properly you`ll see he mentioned getting frustrated at not getting it working.  Theres a big big difference there.......

Reider

[Brett_Henderson]

Here's the key part from post one:

any guidance or "flight lessons" would be much appreciated!

No forcing of anything. I didn't start a thread about instrument flying and force people to read it. I'm simply offering insight into how and why you'd want to learn it all, realistically and when jnigeld11 responded enthusiastically, I continued to offer more information, even as you kept trying to discourage him  ;)

[reider]

wrong, more lies, end of

[PilotDude11]

Im getting a bit frustrated now, so I guess it's time to ask for some guidance! Seems everytime I try an IFR flight, I can't make the approach for landing as I wind up way past the destination airport and so I disengage the autopilot and have to fly around to try and get back to some type of approach at the destination airport again. I follow all of ATC's instructions, but by the time I get the "established on the localizer" thing from ATC, I'm nowhere near the assigned runway approach at the destination airport. I have read various information concerning IFR, ATC, approach, etc and I think I'm employing the information correctly, but the same problem keeps happening. Is this a known issue with FSX at present or am I just an "Idiot Pilot"? any guidance or "flight lessons" would be much appreciated!

Regards,
VFR-for-now-Nigel

you have to make sure you set nav 1 frequency to the frequency of the ils on the runway you are landing on......you can find that frequency by clicking on the airport and checking the data on the particular runway that is open to land on

[jnigeld11]

Now play nice boys!  ;D My IFR report after reading more and re-trying:

Cessna 172
IFR filed Erie to Buffalo
Routed via low altitude...no GPS direct
Fair weather at 13:00 hours EST US, April 30, 2007
Using the FSX auto ATC function
Cruising altitude of 5000ft
Communicating with ATC and following ATC instructions during flight
No GPS used during flight
Using map function for reference
At about 10 miles out of Buffalo, airport in sight and no further communication from ATC
(tuned to Buffalo as instructed)
Flew visual approach to runnway...no communication or instructions from ATC / Buffalo
(tuned to Buffalo as instructed)
Started visual approach / landing...no "cleared to land" communication from ATC / Buffalo
(no option in ATC window to declare anything)
Safe landing at Buffalo...no communications from ATC / Buffalo
(no options in ATC window for Taxi)

I'll continue to read, practice and gather suggestions / information from you "real world" folks!

Regards,
Nigel

[PilotDude11]

[quote]Now play nice boys!

[jnigeld11]

I believe I did, but I'm going to give it another try and see if the same thing happens.

"I'll get back to ya Gene"...From APOLLO 13


Nigel

[Brett_Henderson]

Did you contact Buffalo ? If you're asked to contact, but only tune, that will be the end of your ATC...

You have FSX and what I've been meaning to do, because FSX allows it, is to take people up on multi-player demo flights. I'd host the session and allow the "student" to join my plane (where I'd be sitting the right seat). Either player can do the flying of a shared plane in FSX multi-player. We'd both have the plate in our laps. We'd set the weather for poor visibility and then fly some approaches. There is no computer generated ATC for multi-player, so I'd act as that too. Though with enough participants, FSX has a tower for one of the players to man.. radar screens and all...

PM me if you're interested...

(you'll need a high-speed connection and TeamSpeak)

[PilotDude11]

I believe I did, but I'm going to give it another try and see if the same thing happens.

"I'll get back to ya Gene"...From APOLLO 13


Nigel

let us all know how this attempt goes aswell