No more ILS landings

[ashaman]

A problem already discussed, I know. I've searched for the old topics, uselessly, so allow me to ask again.

Begun my third world tour I've dusted the old and long unused default ATC (just for keeps) and filed my flight plan, but... I've discovered that ATC has abolished ILS procedures.

Suddenly and with no reason, now ATC only dishes out and recognizes visual landing procedures. They've forgot that there's that landing procedure named ILS.

I know this FUBAR has happened already. Does any of you remember the source of the problem?

Please. I have a world tour to do.

Keep in mind that is quite a while that I've not installed anything, scenery-wise. And last time I did, everything worked perfectly.

[beaky]

Perfect opportunity to hone those partial-panel skills!!
Blind approaches at minimums! Weeeee!!



Don't have your answer, so I though I'd try to make you smile.

[ashaman]

Yeah, call me Zatoichi from now on.

It makes me almost want to change nickname. 8-)

Anyway, jokes aside, it's not really a timeless tragedy, as I can still shoot an ILS approach using the vectors the Sim gives me for a visual, if the visibility is nil.

Yes, because the ILS systems works as before. I've checked.

It's simply that really gets on my nerves the fact that ATC refuses to assign ILS approaches AT ALL. Even in the menu for changing the approach type NDB, VOR and Visual Approaches are there (it goes so far to propose a NDB approach on LIRF, of all things), but those idiots on the virtual tower refuse to acknowledge the existence of an ILS system.

And I can't help but wonder what will happen to the AI traffic when the visibility will go down no nil or near nil. Will they begin to do endless go around until the visibility will return good for them to land?

[Nav]

Need more information, ashaman? Are you flying VFR or IFR?

If VFR, ATC will only allocate you an approach (left or right traffic) and a runway - not provide vectors etc. It's pot luck whether you get a runway with ILS or not (though if you want one, you can always try the 'Request another runway' option in the ATC box).

If IFR they should vector you until you're in line with the runway - although, again, depending on wind direction, type of aircraft etc. they may bring you in to a runway without ILS.

As far as "Round World' stuff is concerned, don't know what sort of aeroplane you're using - but if it's a small prop, I did a tute on RW which may provide some hints and tips (sixth from the bottom).

http://www.simviation.com/fsadventures_10.htm

[ashaman]

No, Nav. Things went another way. When I was taking off IFR from LIRN for my first world tour leg I've been told to wait for the landing on a plane, a MD 80, that on the 24 of LIRN announced to be 10 miles out in visual approach.

A MD80 flies always in IFR. LIRN runway 24 has ILS. The AI traffic always uses ILS, when this is available.

This set a number of warning in my head, so I aborted my flight and moved my plane on LIRA. Contacted ground for a VFR clearance and then contacted the tower, and did not move from my parking remaining there monitoring the radio communications.

My LIRA AFCAD had ILS on both runways.

On LIRA all planes in landing received visual clearances to land.

For last I file a IFR flight plane from LIRA to LIRF, (the two main airports in Rome) and in landing I'm told to expect vectors for visual landing. I go in the menu to choose a ILS landing and... there's no ILS procedure to choose.

The ILS system works as before. I can follow the ILS signals to land. I've checked.

It's the ATC that has unilaterally decided that ILS does not exist anymore.

What's happened? And more importantly, how do I put everything back in working order?

[pepper_airborne]

I dont think the ATC ever has assigned ILS approaches in FS9.

[Nav]

Racking my brains, ashaman. Especially since it's literally years since I've 'flown' IFR.

Having to wait for someone on approach is normal enough - but I don't recall them announcing that they're 'visual.' In fact, I don't recall ever hearing anything from the actual aircraft on approach, only 'advisories' from the tower.

I think you may have downloaded some 'goody' in the ATC/flight planning field that modified your ATC procedures - and, in doing so, modified the default setup. Only thing I can suggest (if you can recall what it was) is that you delete it, and then reinstall FS2004. Re-installing doesn't delete any of your other add-ons or downloads, unless you tell it to before you press 'Go.'

Otherwise, maybe just go on with the trip? Sounds as if you don't actually NEED ATC to tell you to carry out an ILS approach, you can check the map and use ILS anyway if it is available?

Good luck with the RW, anyway - I'm already an RW addict, in all sorts of aeroplanes; guess you will be too after a few more trips.

[FridayChild]

Can you determine when was the last time ILS approaches were working, and everything you did to FS since that moment? I know I'm being obvious here, but that's usually the first troubleshooting step.

[ashaman]

Otherwise, maybe just go on with the trip? Sounds as if you don't actually NEED ATC to tell you to carry out an ILS approach, you can check the map and use ILS anyway if it is available?

Good luck with the RW, anyway - I'm already an RW addict, in all sorts of aeroplanes; guess you will be too after a few more trips.  :)

You are right on the money. I don't need ATC. It's simply that sometimes it makes life easier.


Reinstall FS to retrain those idiots in the virtual tower in recognizing ILS. No way. No how. As much I can tell AI traffic can do a successful visual landing even in complete CAT IIIc condition anyway, and I know that ILS is available and can use it. [smiley=evil.gif]


The only ATC modification I did was two good years back, with EditVoicePack, and ATC recognized ILS correctly after the mod was completed.


I'm trying to get this SNAFU resolved before starting the third flight around the simulated world, and begin making my way in the Russian steppe, toward Hokkaido from LIRN. But if really there's no solution but re-installation...


The f...k with it. I'm going to finger off the ATC and will fly MY way around the world.


I have only to determine now if a solution can be found first.

Can you determine when was the last time ILS approaches were working, and everything you did to FS since that moment? I know I'm being obvious here, but that's usually the first troubleshooting step.

That's the problem. For more than 6 months I've been fooling around with single prop planes, jumping around in minor airports where not even a VOR was available, let alone a published instrumental landing procedure. Most of the times I never bothered with ATC either. :-/


Remains assured that the only things I've installed in the last times are planes and some home-made AI traffic, the meshes for Hong Kong (to better use Kai Tak), the service pack to LIRN 2006 of Napulevola and applied some personally modified AFCAD's (added some custom VOR's and ILS to some airports all around Italy that did not have either).


Nothing else.


PS
As I post this, I'm going to try and take those AFCAD away and see if it's their fault. I will go down all the way to disable LIRN 2006 and see if things return to work correctly, but have a feeling it's not them.

[FridayChild]

The AFCAD thing seems to ring a bell somehow.
Try reverting; try flying in another continent; set yourself at, say, JFK for instance and crank the AI traffic to 100%; wear the headphones and tune the tower; see what happens.

[ashaman]

The AFCAD thing seems to ring a bell somehow.
Try reverting; try flying in another continent; set yourself at, say, JFK for instance and crank the AI traffic to 100%; wear the headphones and tune the tower; see what happens.

Tried to take away the most recent AFCAD's and LIRN 2006 did not work in convincing ATC to behave, so I reactivated them.


Then I went in KJFK to do as suggested and...

You're right!!!

At KJFK the ILS is assigned in landing as normal.


Now for the 1 million euros question: The Hell happened and what should I do?

[FridayChild]

Must be something in the AFCAD files you modified. FS is thinking that those airports are not ILS equipped. I'm no expert in this, but perhaps try to isolate the affected airports (I wouldn't be surprised if there were only a few of them) and possibily restore them to default, uninstalling the addon sceneries and restoring any overwritten files from the CD. Remove the areas from scenery.cfg then reinstall those sceneries again one at a time, see if ILS awareness has come back. Good luck.. in culo alla balena.  ;)

[ashaman]

Pretty much got the same thing on my own. Far from happy at the moment. Having to sift between so many AFCAD's (of which a lot hold AI too, now) is far from being a pleasant perspective. Even more so because I have to lose time in waiting for some stray to land and reveal me if the ATC finally remembers the airport(s) have an ILS system.

[born_2_fly]

Pretty much got the same thing on my own. Far from happy at the moment. Having to sift between so many AFCAD's (of which a lot hold AI too, now) is far from being a pleasant perspective. Even more so because I have to lose time in waiting for some stray to land and reveal me if the ATC finally remembers the airport(s) have an ILS system.

Why not fix the ones you will be using for the world tour now, and do the rest in your own time/when you need them  ;)

[beaky]

I dont think the ATC ever has assigned ILS approaches in FS9.

Sure it has. Always mentioned in ATIS ("ILS Runway XX in use"), enroute controllers will assign them("expect vectors ILS Runway XX"), and towers will clear for them ("Cleared ILS runway XX").