[woodworm]

Hi there all,
The basics of my set up is as follows:
XP1700 o/c to XP2200
Asus A7V 333 mobo
512mb DDR PC3200 cas2.5
GF4 Ti 4600
80GB and 120GB DiamondMax Plus 9 HDD's

What would be the best direction for upgrading the above system given that the main reason would be to enhance my enjoyment  of FS2004 ? I have around

[congo]

Your TI4600 is quite a capable card, a CPU upgrade will push it further; Say a 2400+ nothing less.

I had a A7S333 mainboard, the SIS Asus variant of what you have.

Your MainBoard is one of those rare "transition" boards between technologies.
It has a 266mhz front side bus, It will run RAM at 333mhz, and you have 400mhz RAM installed, Most likely running underclocked unless you have overclocked your PC.
If you are an overclocking GURU, you MIGHT get more out of your present mainboard, but if not, you are limited with it as far as upgrade options go.

Your RAM will slip into a new mainboard quite well, as will a nice new powerful CPU, running at 333mhz FSB instead of your current 266mhz. But that's AMD. At this stage you also have the choice of upgrading your mainboard and CPU to a P4 type, the choice is yours.

Back to what you have now... Wow! a check on the Asus website for bios and CPU support shows your mainboard will take up to an XP 3000+ @333mhz FSB, What a surprise!
Looks like your board has some life in it yet!

The Difference in actual CPU speed isn't very much between the 2600+ thoroughbreds (333mhz FSB) and the later Barton cored 333mhhz FSB AMD cpu's, so there is a bargain in the offing there if you look around.

Here is my suggestion:

Get a 333mhz FSB AMD XP CPU, (2800+ ?) either a Thoroughbred or a Barton core, make sure is comes boxed with a fan.

Grab an extra 512mb RAM stick, identical in spec and brand to what you have now, your board has 3 ram slots.

Get your new bios and flash it, or get some tech to do it.

Wind your front side bus speed up to 333mhz (this will actually be about 167mhz, but 334mhz because of DDR mode.)

Stick in the new CPU, and set the ram to run at 333mhz as well! That's right! Degrade it so it's like PC2700. Your machine will actually run faster, it's a well documented fact. Ram @ 400mhz on these machines causes a slight performance loss. There is another benefit, your CL2.5 ram sticks should now be able to clock at the faster CL2 timing and remain stable. (timings 6-2-2-2)

Now it will be a fast machine! 333mhz fsb, cpu and ram, all balanced and cranking!

Your new spec:

A CPU that's roughly equivalent to a P4 3gig......

1024mb DDR @ 333mhz...

333mhz FSB speed




Try that TI4600 again now, I think you'll be surprised, but wait! Make sure when you up the front side bus speed to 333mhz, that your AGP bus speed and PCI bus speeds aren't tied to it, but keep them the original values. All these options will be available in the BIOS once upgraded.

I imagine a before and after run in 3d mark 2001se will show something like:

Before-  10000pts

After -    14000 pts

If you still need a performance boost, get your shiny new FX card.

Good Luck

[woodworm]

Thanks congo for taking the time and providing such an informative reply !!  :)
Just a point or two.
1) Given that I will proceed as you suggest  i.e CPU and RAM  upgrade  before considering the graphics card option , I read that  the XP2800 (FSB 333MHz) TBred CPU runs at 2.25GHz wheras the  Barton XP2800 (FSB333MHz) runs 2.08GHz and the XP3000 (FSB333MHz) at 2.15GHz. Therefore , given that the main reason for upgrading is to run FS2004 better, would it be best to go for the Barton XP2800 (improved architecture but lower GHz) or XP2800 TBred (higher GHz). These 2 CPU's appear be around the same price i.e.

[4_Series_Scania]

Pentium 4 Northwood3.0 Ghz 800fsb CPU

[woodworm]

Well well well......thanks for the advice  4_Series_Scania  :)   -  this is definitely  an avenue that I'd not considered due to knowing zero about pentium systems.  I've always built AMD puters and I suppose having gained a little knowledge through trail and error, I just feel comfortable probing around their innards. However, I'm open minded and would be willing to go the pentium road if the gains merited the change.
What's becoming clear from the feedback is that my upgrade should be centered on improving the CPU/Mobo/Ram and not the Ti4600 graphics card. Therefore will a pentium system e.g.  Pentium 4 Northwood 3.0 Ghz  noticeably out-perform an 'equivalent' rated AMD e.g. Barton XP 3000 sytem with reference to running FS2004?
Thanks

[congo]

I would go for the Higher Actual Speed, ie. non Barton.

My 2600+ thoroughbred clocks benches faster than an XP3000+ Barton with a tiny tweak.

[4_Series_Scania]

OEM Cpu's are fraught with danger, many second hand cpu's are finding there way onto the market as OEM and could have prior damage not apparent immediately.

CRAP !

Sorry mate, but an "OEM" cpu simply means the CPU sold without a fan or cooler, nowt more nowt less!

Intel's 800fsb p4's are a far faster option than an AMD XP - Granted, earlier XP's were better than the p4 equivalents, not so these days.

Don't take my word for it, go check out any decent hardware site such as http://www20.tomshardware.com/cpu/20031223/cpu-guide-22.html

The Pentium 4 has slightly better performance reserves and more than 3.2 GHz can probably be squeezed from Socket 478, meaning that the extra investment in the processor will pay off over the long term.

What Tomshardware says,not me....

Congo - STOP CALLING ME FIREMAN!!!!

[leworthy8]

Dont believe what you read in Toms hardware review he 110% biased to intel its so funny its not true!!!!!!!!!.

[4_Series_Scania]

Dont believe what you read in Toms hardware review he 110% biased to intel its so funny its not true!!!!!!!!!.

Ok, Fair point, (possibly).... Better see what another site says... http://www.sharkyextreme.com/hardware/motherboards/article.php/10703_2190511__7

Strangely enough, the verdict's the same, the p4's are quicker but more expensive than the AMD XP's.

"Bang for buck" the AMD's certainly represent value, woodworm was specifically looking for performance, which is why I point him in Intel's direction.

Says it all I think.  ;)

Paul.

[congo]

OMG!  :o

That's it! I'm blaming the medication!  ;D

Sorry Paul, and Fireman LOL

[Daz]

[quote]Choice 2-