cfs3 or PF

[BaldGuy]

Great discussion.
Excellent to hear from the developer as well.
(Oleg that is)

My 2c worth is that the IL2 series is way better than
CFS1/2/3 plus the addons.
The reasons ?
1) FM
2) Customer support (Oleg's team)
3) graphics
4) gameplay
5) ballistics
6) damage model
7) customer support (Oleg's team...again)

The Il2 craft FLY right and look right.
The CFS ones do not.

I have 'flown' both.

My log book has just cranked over 14,000hours in everything from a C-150 Aerobat to a B-744.
Sure I never flew a wwII fighter, and I bow with respect to those that have.

For me, I want a simulation so I choose to fly Il2 and it's derivatives.
If had wanted a game I would still be flying CFS1/2/3.

At the end of the day, enjoy what you do.

[Beery1]

Hehe, I'm sorry, but IL-2 (or PF) vs CFS is kinda like Britney vs Christina. Two pretty yet talent-free competitors in a competition for which they shouldn't even qualify. If there was a heavyweight flight sim out there, those two aces of mediocrity wouldn't even be on our radar.

If Dynamix was still around, or if another Falcon came out, maybe we could talk about serious flight sims, but in my opinion IL-2 and CFS are (and always have been) second-rate sims, appealing to arcade fans and sim enthusiasts who are temporarily blinded by chrome. Neither has any sort of dynamic campaign, and IL-2 (with its scripted missions posing as a campaign) has about the least intuitive campaign structure I've seen in a combat flight sim.

In short, these are bad flight sims that use pretty graphics to cover serious flaws. Oleg Maddox creates a mediocre flight sim with horrible AI, bad damage models and questionable flight models (which change bimonthly) and because he's on top of the graphics curve he's lauded as the second f***ing coming. He and his megalomaniac attitude disgust me. As for CFS, the less said about it the better. It's slightly worse than the IL-2 series because it has never attempted to even pretend to include a dynamic campaign. Both sims make me hurl.

[BlakJakofSpades]

bear i dont know if you know, but that is neither the highest graphics settings nor the choppiest weather setting. perhaps someone can provide a picture of more adverse conditions on water = 3?

[Santa]

Well I'll offer my 2 cents as well.

IL-2, FB, AEP, Pacific Fighters is easily a superior simulator to CFS3, particularly because of the better FM.

I gave up on CFS3 (and earlier CFS 1/2) because of the lack of realism imparted by the flight model.  The Il-2 series FM is quite a bit better even than FS2004.

I'm a real world pilot although unlike BaldGuy above I'm a private pilot and somewhat junior with less than 100 hours (14,000 hours seems incredible!)  

One of the earlier commentators did not like the forrests in Il-2 when down low... Well I love the forrests - from any angle above these achieve a strong impression of thousands of trees.  The graphic engine is cleverly designed to achieve this effect while using a minimum of computational power.. allowing more to be offered elsewhere. Compromises always have to be made between graphics, sound, physics modelling and computational power.

Hi Oleg! Thank you Oleg for your tireless dedication to excellence. I'm very impressed that you took the time to answer some of commentators directly.. you can never please everyone  
Cool that you try though.

Quote from Oleg, "Also especialy for these that has more power PC we soon will release the FM that take more processor time for calculations. I would say it will be pre-BoB FM (for all around the world testing in the current sim series. "  Awesome news.  The best FM for a home PC is about to get even better. I'm looking forward to it already.

Santa  

[Mathias]

Gee, many first time posters here lately.
Makes me wonder if that's all new fans of the MS flight simulator series. Or is there a hole in the UbiZoo fence
So we're going to start allover again where we put off on page 2, huh?
It's kinda like watching the same old soap on TV over and over again.

[Mathias]

Those wakes shure look impressive!

[BaldGuy]

Santa, I think you will find that a lot of real world pilots will prefer the Il2 genre over the CFS stuff because of the FM and the DM...err and the ballistics (especially the military guys) err....and the visuals...umm...and the product support...etc. etc.

(The reason why I have the hours is that I do it for a living, and had my first lesson at 16. I'm now 43. If you do the mathematics, it's not that many hours per year).

Anyway, each to his/her own.

[Plumps]

[quote]

Nice picture of the carrier in what I guess is supposed to be the Pacific ocean.

This is a picture of my fathers ship,

[BFawlty]

WOW!  ::)

BF

[IndioBlack]

If Oleg is popping around these days, can he say why his Sim does not support multiple throttle axes for multi-engine aircraft like CFS2 and CFS3 do?

The potential is there, because he has some great multi-engine Bombers like the TB3 available in FORGOTTEN BATTLES, and PACIFIC FIGHTERS claims to have the B-25. But the Sim control is rather complicated, with the player needing to press a key to select an particular engine before then using the single throttle axis to control it.

Those of us with the CH Quad Throttle can control individual engines in our B-25 with separate levers.  And those of us who have downloaded the free AV History B-17 can use multiple axes to control all four engines individually.

I would have bought PACIFIC FIGHTERS if I could control the B-25 throttles, mixtures and prop pitches with individual axes, but since I can't, I bought CFS3 instead, in order to experience realistic piloting of Bombers.

Since Oleg produces massive and regular patches for his Sim, I cannot see why he will not increase the number of controllable axes, unless of course it is too complicated to do. Or maybe the flight models just wouldn't behave realistically enough if he did.

[AvHistory]

[quote]

[WhiskeyBravo]

There you go being disengenious again.  You seem to want to talk about things that FB doesnt model so that you can then state that CFS3 is better because it does.   Well then lets talk about simulating the East Front air war in general shall we?  How does CFS3 stack up in that arena?

You are obviously passionate about simming but why do you try to constantly trade one off against the other?  Is there anything good that you will say for FB?

WB.

Edit - BTW I'm not into the my water is better than your water scene - I just posted the pics in answer to your reply about the water features.

[Mathias]

[quote]There you go being disengenious again.

[flyingbullseye]

I should desagree with you almost at all.

Beginnig from dive characterisitics.

Take two planes with you friend and test it online, starting o the same altitude wing to wing....

[flyingbullseye]

Yak-3 was good Spitfire is also good... But Zero would be better if they all will go on the same speed maneuver. Please take it in account.  I think my guys flying in the Zero online with you in maneverable dogfight will shot you down all the times in Yak-3 or in Spitfire if you speak such things..
I think you missed understood me, I really need to expound on my points better.  Again since I only fly offline I was able to stay with the Zero, all settings set on realistic.  The only time that I couldn't stay with it is when the AI climbs beyond the pull of gravity.  

AI doing sometime not so good maneuvers.. Yes. Unless you can repeat them. - they use the same FM as you.... However with new FM they will be not able to make such things (you too)... simply becasue it will be impossible (But I can do so great things with FM and AI of CFS3.....)
All AI cheats, CFS3 included.  The 1c AI either climbs beyond whats realistic, or seeing this myself has made a 360 turn on its axis without even banking much.  CFS3 AI can outturn you in the same plane, high alt has no effect ect, just in your defence.

Lastly in your defence PF will freeze up just as much as any other sim or game.  I didn't make that clear, my CPU will be able to handle who ever's BOB comes out.  

My hats off to you for actually discussing anything about the sim, others as we know don't which puts you in a different class than the rest.  Don't take this post as a negitive or harsh tone, not hearing someone talk many times people get the wrong impression and the flames begin.  I still believe if one were to take all of the positives from both sims and combine them into one that would be an awsome sim!  :)