cfs3 or PF

The latest Air Battle game from Microsoft! Running on an entirely new platform, CFS3 is raising it's fair share of problems & opinions - Good & Bad!

Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby beaky » Sun Dec 26, 2004 1:10 pm

So much for "to each his own"... ouch! For what it's worth, I base my knowledge of  WWII aircraft  on years of (admittedly casual) study of various sources, including talking in person with WWII fighter pilots (would that be an accurate source?), and my knowledge of aircraft performance on over 200 hrs. flying real aircraft, including some aerobatics. A world away from flying WWII fighters, I know, but the same basic rules apply- the numbers are different, that's all.  And as long as we're splitting hairs, the white smoke thing refers to oil coming in contact with the hot engine; I only mentioned it because I noticed in PF if the oil res. is punctured or whatever, the plane starts streaming black smoke. Haven't really noticed the excessive gun smoke (my bad on that misread), but I don't doubt it- ubisoft definitely goes for the drama in the exterior views.  I'll check on the symmetrical damage thing, too- that's stupid.
 I was a little annoyed at first by the tendency of most of the IL2/PF planes to stall when least expected to, but I've learned to deal with it.  I'm pretty convinced that CFS3 is more forgiving in this regard because they made it easier. But  one of the things I like about PF2 is that there's plenty of audible and visual warning (shaking and slipstream noise) of an impending stall, so my last few flights have been much better... given enough altitude, even if I do lose it for a second, they seem to recover in a realistic fashion (I don't know for sure, having never flown anything quite like these planes, but dump nose/opposite rudder usual yields the same result in PF as it has in my own experience in real aircraft).  Anyway, we could go on and on like this- what's needed to really answer the questions about realism is to put matching fighters from each sim through identical flight tests, then compare the results for both aircraft to some accepted historical description of performance, i.e. the manufacturer's manual, or perhaps their production  test results.  I'd rather be dogfighting, but maybe I'll try it.
 Both of these sims have their good and bad points, but the bottom line, for me at least, is that IL2/PF gives a more realistic experience, primarily in having a workable view and being forced to work within the aircrafts' limitations. Those two factors are what drove me away from CFS3.
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby beaky » Sun Dec 26, 2004 1:21 pm

Interesting pics, Avhistory... so far in PF, if I lose an elevator, I can hardly expect a problem-free landing.  As far as the biplane goes, I'm surprised the upper wing remained attached. Never seen anything like that when I'm running PF, and I always have the realism settings maxed.  Maybe I should let my plane get hit more often... ;)
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Mathias » Sun Dec 26, 2004 1:27 pm

Well there where certainly planes that where a bitch to fly other where certainly a pleasent experience judging by the various WWII pilots accounts.
BTW, havn't seen any pilots manual that describes a plane as a death trap (and I own quite a couple of these, LOL). It's true though that pilot manuals tend to go with savety procedures while the real aircraft could be well flown over the handbook borders.
Not to become personall or something but I believe you're trying to appear more than you are judging by the standard statements you bring in here, that sort that each 16 years old kid over at UbiZoo quotes as knowledge and fact :)
I'm surprised btw that the IL-2ish default scripted takeoffs stall'spin'n merry go'round escape your attention, thought one should expect some differences between different planetypes but maybe wing designs, washout and such are just for the idiots at the drawing board?
Last edited by Mathias on Sun Dec 26, 2004 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Woodlouse2002 » Sun Dec 26, 2004 3:06 pm

What on earth is up with those little red cones on that biplane?
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby beaky » Sun Dec 26, 2004 7:37 pm

Everybody has opinions, mattsmurf, and all I've been doing on this thread  is expressing mine. If the average WWII fighter was more stable than as depicted in PF, or if ubi got lazy and cut'n'pasted when they should've done more research and/or revamped the game engine, so be it. As I said, I haven't even spent much time with CFS3, as the problems with views turned me off big-time (just a personal preference). If your research material is more accurate than mine, so be it. I'm not trying to pass myself off as anything I'm not ('tho it'd be nice to be 16 again!!). All I'm saying is that based on what I know (which is certainly not everything), IL2/PF is real enough for me, and since taking it easy,  with the few aircraft in that sim that I've flown, to get a better feel for the perf. envelope as depicted in that sim, I haven't had any problems. AND... this thread has convinced me not to write off CFS3 until I mess with it some more.  :)
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Tomtomcat » Sun Dec 26, 2004 10:13 pm

At the moment I do play IL-2/PF a lot more than
CFS3 simply because I can
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Mathias » Mon Dec 27, 2004 3:19 am

[quote]Everybody has opinions, mattsmurf, and all I've been doing on this thread
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby beaky » Mon Dec 27, 2004 10:05 am

It's all good, matt- passion is a big part of the simming/gaming experience. I was more gushing about PF than I was bashing CFS3, y'know? Speaking of fixes, do you know what I mean about the forward view in CFS3? I need to re-install it and check again, but I seem to recall losing all my eyepoint settings even if I looked left or right then returned to the forward view. Not 100% sure about that, but definitely would lose them after switching to another view (which is "cheating", I know, but useful when one is learning to use the sim). If I could overcome that, I'd be ready to give CFS3 another shot.
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Microsoft Corporation » Mon Dec 27, 2004 1:24 pm

Looks like AvHistory needs more work on his gunnery.
Last edited by Microsoft Corporation on Mon Dec 27, 2004 1:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: cfs3 or PF
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Mathias » Mon Dec 27, 2004 2:07 pm

[quote]Anyone try to e-mail MS and get an answer about next update for CFS3?
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Mathias » Mon Dec 27, 2004 2:17 pm

Rottydaddy, I'm afraid there's not much you can do to avoid the views to reset when switching around.
You can customize your views though so that they fit your needs right away without zooming in or out.

You'd have to open the aircraft's xdp file in Notepad and edit the Field of view, the FovUp and FovDown portions



You can also adjust the snapviews.
The following example has an offset added.
If you use your hatswitch or keyboard to look fore/right it'll turn 45
Last edited by Mathias on Mon Dec 27, 2004 2:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby AvHistory » Mon Dec 27, 2004 4:34 pm

>>>PF is still very much a work in progress<<<

Stick a fork in it its done. UBI has pulled the plug on PF just like they did to Eagle & LOMAC.
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Microsoft Corporation » Mon Dec 27, 2004 8:24 pm

[quote]

I would certainly agree, Oleg's patch records are quite impressive.
He ought to if he wants to keep his closed sim alive.
Although one might wonder what a 120MB
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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby AvHistory » Mon Dec 27, 2004 9:40 pm

>>>I will be a buyer.<<<

There is no charge for MAW 8)

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Re: cfs3 or PF

Postby Mathias » Tue Dec 28, 2004 3:39 am

Yep, MAW is freeware. :)
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