A humble request - please forgive

[dcunning30]

I haven't posted a whole lot here so I consider myself a junior member, even though I sometimes am quite expressive in my opinions.

[james007]

Dcunning30 we do not understand how much degration and insults our fellow American Japanese received in that period of history.

They depicted them as monkeys and less than human. I was just seeing a program in the History channel last night about the Japanese Atomic Bomb program. We new very little about it because we never thought they where capabable of producing one.

I have brought this point before about how much we needed to feel superior to them at that time in history.

Dcunning you brought a good up valid point. I love historical discusstions and to exchage differrent Ideas. But I try never to offend anyone on a personal level.

I will try my best not to use such term in the future Dcunning30.

Thank you for bringing it up.

James007

[dcunning30]

I saw that too!  Who'da thunk it that the Japanese exploded an experimental a-bomb?  But with the way things were after the war and currently today, we may never learn one way or another.  The Russians aren't talking, and certainly North Korea won't permit access to that area.

[dcunning30]

I have brought this point before about how much we needed to feel superior to them at that time in history.

You know, they did it too.  You know, that's one of the ugly sides of warfare.  How are you able to kill on impulse, someone who under different circumstances, could end up being your best buddy?

The NAZI's had Arian superiority
We had our racial stereotypes of half/blind bucktooth brutes
The Japanese considered the emperor desendent of Anaterasu, and the Japanese people were the superior race with the concept of "All eight corners of the world under one roof" which was their own version of manifest destiny.

[james007]

You are right Dcunning. They where probably worst than us. Lets not forget that the Japanese military killed millions of people during the war by design.

That was then and now we have grown I hope. The only difference is that I hold our self to a higher standards of value since we have incorporated Cristian Judeo values to our our sociaty as our main standard of value.

Thank you

James007

[Corsair Freak]

I'm guilty of saying 'Japs' I'm just so use to yelling colorful words at my monitor... I'll try my best to say Japanese.  ;)

[stiz]

First of if i offend anyone please slap me!

I dont like being PC and think it just softens words for people who cant take being offened.

To me the word Jap is just a cut down version of Japanese, to me its just another word like Yankie for Americans, Jerry for German etc (know any for british go ahead and say it cos i cant think of one). I know people take offence by these sometimes so i try not to use them in front of them.  

Also everyone i have met (mainly young americans in this case, everyone else i now couldn't care less) thinks that the Japanese are savages and not human, what they seem to forget is that they belived strongly and so acted on thier belifes (i'm not explaining this very well am i??) and that they were that of the samuri (spelling??) and that dieing for thier country would be of great benifit to the country. Just because in most cases instead of throwing up thier arms they faught to the death does not mean they are savage, so they used different methods of torture etc its just 2 different worlds meeting. Rember that america had all the mod cons of the age most of Japan was still little huts on a hill somewhere.

If i am wrong with any of the above please correct me but to my knowledge its all true.  

[Corsair Freak]

(know any for british go ahead and say it cos i cant think of one)

Brits, Redcoats.  :)


Good Hunting,
Brandon

[james007]

I"m Stiz but could not disagree with you more. Japan was not a poor little country pretending to be a world power at the beginning of the war.

Japan was a World power to be recon with. It had a well dicipline Army. One of the world best air force.
It also had the best navy in the world.

Yes the best navy period at the beginning of the war. How can you say this when every one knows the Royal navy was the best in the world in 1941.

Well let me explain it in simple form. In the mid thirties the major powers in the world sign the first of its kind arms control treaties.

The Japanese simply cheated and build the biggest Battleships of that era. They also had the best naval fighter in the world. The famouse Zero. The first capable to fight on equal terms the land fighters.

Excellent Dive Bombers and Torpedos. A more modern naval doctrine base on the aircraft carrier instead of the Battleships.

They where the first to have a more modern concept for military beach landings.  

The first to use leapfrogging landings behind enemy lines.

They practice it quite often during the Chinese Invation in the thirties.

Thats how they won the Battle of Shangai in 1937. They leapfrogg behind the Chinese lines and unhinged their defences.

Their Oriental Blitz of 1941 and early 1942 was a master peice that has been poorly study. Perhaps because it was not executed by a western power or becuase we where embarrass by it. It has not receive the same attention that the German Blitz of Europe has.

The Japanese where tough and a determine enemy. When condition where favorable and they where well fed and lead they where amoun the best troops in the world.

Your mentality have the the same mind set of the British had in 1941. They though that one British soldier was worth ten Japanese.

Well the Britain received it worst defeat in its military history in the Signapore campaign.

Yes they where strange enemy from our point view. They did things different with strage and sometimes hard to understand tatics.

But overall they probably where the toughest enemy the allies ever met in the Battlefield.

So you see our troops and fighting men from all the nations that parcicipated in this Theater of war deserve all our respect and honor for defeating such a enemy.

I recomend for all of us to read more about this and all the other Theaters of war in World war 2.

The more we learn the more we will appreciate what that genertion did for us today.

Never undereastimate anybody or nation or it could End up bitting you.

You now where.

This only a warning! LoL

This just a opinion

James007

[Hagar]

Also everyone i have met (mainly young americans in this case, everyone else i now couldn't care less) thinks that the Japanese are savages and not human

I see that wartime propaganda is still believed by the masses.

Just because in most cases instead of throwing up thier arms they faught to the death does not mean they are savage,

In some cases this was a difference in culture. Surrender was seen as the ultimate disgrace in the Samurai code. Many Japanese civilians & ordinary soldiers committed suicide rather than surrender as they'd been told & believed that Americans were subhuman. Propaganda is used on both sides during a war to give ordinary people a reason to fight. I believe this is one point of Darryl's topic.

Brits, Redcoats.

That seems a little old-fashioned. British soldiers were usually called Tommies after Tommy Atkins. http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/lj/warslj/army_04.shtml I don't know what the Japanese called them. This was usually an affectionate name used by allies & enemy alike. In the same way Americans were called Yanks & also Cowboys by German airmen. Japanese were commonly referred to as Japs or Nips by the Allied troops, neither of which was complimentary.

[Corsair Freak]

That's the one I was thinkin' of... I just couldn't think of it at the time.

[dcunning30]

james007,

I'm reading God's Samurai for the second time and Fuchida give uncanny incite.

[dcunning30]

I kinda jumped ahead regarding the Halsey comment.  Fuchida said that later on in reference to the carrier raids that Halsey had been conducting.  Spruance was also involved in carrier raids, but Fuchida recognized Halsey's agressiveness, and also Spruance's methodical calculations.  And Fuchida considered what Japan needed was an agressive admiral.  Japan had one in Yamaguchi, but steeped in the Bushido code, Yamaguchi chose to go down with the Hiryu at Midway.

Now, Yamamoto was an agressive admiral, probably too much of a gambler for Japan's own good.  Contrast that with what Nimitz advised Fletcher and Spruance prior to Midway:  Use a doctrine of inflicting maximum damage on the enemy only when it appears risk to your own forces appears at a minimum. (my own words, but that was the point Nimitz made)

Problem was Yamamoto groomed his successor to toe the line, and that's exactly what Koga did.  And that was exactly what Japan DIDN'T need.

[AvHistory]

First of if i offend anyone please slap me!

I am way to old to be PC but consider yourself slapped - its racial slur pure & simple.

[quote]Rember that america had all the mod cons of the age most of Japan was still little huts on a hill somewhere.

[james007]

Bear thank you for your input. I appreciate it very much.
What the average amature historian and I believe even many professional historian do not realize is that