FBI and Apple - The facts

If it doesn't fit .. It fits here .. - -

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby OldAirmail » Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:40 pm

FUD
Fear, uncertainty and doubt - FUD is generally a strategy to influence perception by disseminating negative and dubious or false information and a manifestation of the appeal to fear.



Apple CEO Tim Cook: FBI request would make millions vulnerable

Cook: FBI asking Apple to write software equivalent of cancer

If Apple loses, your home could be the next thing that's unlocked



I'm getting really sick and tired of this self serving egotistical b*st*rd. He really thinks that he's the Emperor of the World.

If anyone didn't read the links in the first post it goes something like this: The FBI is asking to have the ten, incorrect, password limit removed from a killers phone so that they could try to gain assess THEMSELVES.

This has to be done be Apple, and it can be done to ONLY the killers phone. Apple does not have to give this technology to the FBI, and it WILL NOT work on any other iPhone.

Essentially, Apple would issues a software update aimed at that iPhone while the phone was in their presence.

So why is Tim Cook talking about cancer and the end of the world as we know it?



I don't know about other countries, but here in the US, if Law enforcement can convince a judge to grant a search warrant, they can;
Search your house
Search your automobile
Search areas where you have access, such as your work desk, gym locker, etc.
Take and search your computer
Search your phone call records
Search your bank records and safe deposit box.
Even the old Swiss bank accounts are no longer a safe place to put your ill-gotten gains.
And I'm sure that the list can go on and on.

It all turns on a judge being convinced that there is "probable cause". Fourteen dead people in San Bernardino might give probable cause.



So what's the problem?

Tim Cook is egotistical, and untouchable. NO ONE will dare to contest his will! :evil:

He's one of the most powerful people alive and he knows it.

Image
.. .
Get the most out of your controls - SPAD.neXt

Image
. . . . . .Any time, any plane, any weather.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . Prepar3d V4
User avatar
OldAirmail
Major
Major
 
Posts: 4814
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:06 pm
Location: Concrete, WA ICAO - 3W5

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby stephan » Sat Feb 27, 2016 6:53 pm

Maybe I am missing something. I know MANY folks use their phones to pay bills etc. Seems like a lazy way to me. The peoples of the now age have become so lazy,they can even shop and do so without leaving their homes,from clothing to groceries. Myself,...I have a generic cell phone. Doesnt even take pics. No need for an elaborate,expensive phone with a rather pricey monthly contract.
Personally,I feel it is risky AND unnecessary to be so lazy as to pay bills and such over the phone rather than get up off of ones big behind,jump into a car and go pay a bill or two.
If someone were to hack into my phone (for whatever reason they saw fit) all they'd get is a few phone numbers...that's it. Hell...they can get that from a phone book.
Anyone that places sensitive,important data on a phone neednt complain if they get ''hit''. Ignorance of the risk is ones own fault,...and WHO is really ignorant of the risk anyway?
LET the government do their job.
LET them have the code...
and quit being so damned lazy that your entire existence relies on your phone.
Get an envelope,a stamp and pay your bills.
Get in your cars and pay your bills.
Placing sensitive data on a phone is not only reckless... you are simply asking for trouble... all for the sake of being lazy.
stephan
 

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby OldAirmail » Sat Feb 27, 2016 8:58 pm

I'm with you there.


Speaking of "sensitive data" on phones - some guy worked his way into the phones of a bunch of "celebrities" and downloaded their nude selfies.

Don't ask me who they were. For the most part, what passes for a "celebrity" nowadays is someone acting up just to get noticed.

Why bother with 'em.
.. .
Get the most out of your controls - SPAD.neXt

Image
. . . . . .Any time, any plane, any weather.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . Prepar3d V4
User avatar
OldAirmail
Major
Major
 
Posts: 4814
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:06 pm
Location: Concrete, WA ICAO - 3W5

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby logjam » Sun Feb 28, 2016 12:37 am

Wasn't me.

Image
User avatar
logjam
Major
Major
 
Posts: 1301
Joined: Tue Mar 26, 2002 3:10 am
Location: Lillooet, BC Canada

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby OldAirmail » Thu Jun 30, 2016 5:31 pm

Some new Apple info to think about.


OK. Apple won the test of will against the FBI.

Or, to look at it another way, the FBI gave up and found someone else to break into a terrorists iPhone

From still another viewpoint, Apple has shown that they're standing for Truth, Justice, and The American Terrorist Way.



BUT! Have heart people. Apple knows better than we, what is sacred - Copyrights! :dance:

Not only that, but they've developed a way to protect the innocent copyrighter.

Apple wants to bust your bootlegs by blocking iPhone video recording at concerts

Shish! And people denigrate Micro$oft! :doh:
.. .
Get the most out of your controls - SPAD.neXt

Image
. . . . . .Any time, any plane, any weather.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . Prepar3d V4
User avatar
OldAirmail
Major
Major
 
Posts: 4814
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:06 pm
Location: Concrete, WA ICAO - 3W5

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby Webb » Thu Jun 30, 2016 9:12 pm

And what did the FBI find on the phone?

Image
"Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!" - Sen. John Blutarsky

You know, this used to be a helluva good country. I don't understand what's gone wrong with it. - George Hanson, 1969

A bad day at golf is better than a good day at work.


Image

Jim
User avatar
Webb
Major
Major
 
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 4:45 pm
Location: KBCT

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby OldAirmail » Thu Jun 30, 2016 11:47 pm

Webb wrote:And what did the FBI find on the phone?

Personally, I don't know. Nor is it important that I do know. To me, it's important that an effort is made to stop further killings.

This was very specific - a pair of killers might have been working with others. This was not a case where the FBI said that they want to look at everyone's phone records.

But if it was something that could have prevented another mass killing, or even something like this - Jewish girl, 13, stabbed to death in West Bank bedroom, wouldn't it have been worth invading a killers privacy?

Thirteen years old.
STABBED to death.
By someone like the San Bernardino killers - fourteen people were killed, 22 injured.
Who's next? Where?

Unfortunately, we're at that point that Stalin talked about - "The death of one man is a tragedy. The death of millions is a statistic."

Are you so inured that you see no reason to track down like minded killers?

What's a few more lives? Are they just more "statistics"?

Something like sports scores, interesting, but of no real importance?
.. .
Get the most out of your controls - SPAD.neXt

Image
. . . . . .Any time, any plane, any weather.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . Prepar3d V4
User avatar
OldAirmail
Major
Major
 
Posts: 4814
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:06 pm
Location: Concrete, WA ICAO - 3W5

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby Webb » Fri Jul 01, 2016 12:12 am

OldAirmail wrote: This was not a case where the FBI said that they want to look at everyone's phone records.

Unfortunately, it was.

The government wanted to establish the precedent that it could force software writers to provide "back doors" to defeat their own security.

No need to worry, though. We know how good the government is at keeping secrets. This hack would have been public information within hours.

If you don't know what the government found on the phone, it was nothing, zero, zip, zilch - which everyone expected.

"It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer" - William Blackstone
"Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor? Hell no!" - Sen. John Blutarsky

You know, this used to be a helluva good country. I don't understand what's gone wrong with it. - George Hanson, 1969

A bad day at golf is better than a good day at work.


Image

Jim
User avatar
Webb
Major
Major
 
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2010 4:45 pm
Location: KBCT

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby pete » Fri Jul 01, 2016 2:40 am

I don't trust any government who thinks they have the right to peep into our lives if they want to.

One reason I do not use Apple as my phone is that they do seem to want to control what you can and cannot do - more than Android devices - as well as the fact that the Android system is shared by many phones - with an open source availability of apps - you don't have to go to the parent company (Google) to get them like you do with Apple

Just a few weeks ago I got a email reminder of a dental appointment. 30 mins before the appointment my phone vibrated with a message (not from gmail) telling me it was time to leave and 'tap here for directions' - I congratulated the dentist on their system and they say they did nothing more than sent me the email reminder the day before. It was the smartphone.

I don't doubt that the intention all of all this digital progress is good - However it's still frightening that these operating systems are becoming so 'intelligent' that things are working beyond our knowledge. If you have a smartphone, the data of so much of your life is known by 'the system'. Who your friends/associates are (why I don't use facebook - but they know anyhow because i call and message my real friends). Everywhere you go. What you buy online. Your hobbies. Medical. Likely income level. ---- and God forbid should computers/digital world become so intelligent that they could be beyond our control (which probably will happen) -- they will know virtually everything about us and just think what could occur if that basic life element -'survival of the fittest' started to happen.

Can we be the masters of them forever? I doubt it.

& ... 'Life' does not have to be biological to be self sustaining
Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. – Leonardo da Vinci
User avatar
pete
Administrator
Administrator
 
Posts: 10234
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2001 2:01 am
Location: Cloud Cuckoo Land

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby Jetranger » Fri Jul 01, 2016 3:27 am

This is an APPLE CONCERT BULLETIN ALERT NOTICE !!!

APPLE TO DECIDE WHAT YOU will and will NOT Record with your Techno' Phone Devices

APPLE says it has Technology to STOP You from being able to Record at Concerts in Public :o

Whoaaaa, that sounds a little intrusive and beyond some legal reach to me, but what do I know, I'm just a Phony make believe illusionary Airplane Pilot ,,,,,,,,,,

Next if APPLE doesn't like you for whatever reason,,,, they may Disable your Vehicle so you can't go anywhere, and they may shut off all the Electricity to your house - without you knowing it - unless YOU subscribe to thousands of dollars of their services every month - or - NO Lights for you :shock: :evil:

Just thinking into the Future is all, the way things will be,,, unless YOU do exactly as I say, I'LL turn your life upside down and inside out , wanna know how ?????

Those Techno' Devices ya'll cling to like a Baby to a Pacifier,,,, called Cell Phones ~ !!!

You've got em' Jammed in your Ears every which way, Jammed into your mouths, up your noses, even in places you shouldn't,,,, why your so consumed by those Techno' Pacifiers, your beginning to act like one, you no longer think, you let the Techno' Pacifier do your Thinking for you , even doing your driving for you, right into the back end of that Stopped Bus :o

These TECHNO' Pacifiers are your new BRAIN, cause you evidently gave yours up a long time ago, to buy into all this goofy macab' grand wizardry that's taken over your lives !

APPLE to Decide what YOU will and will NOT Record : New Apple patent could block iPhone recording at concerts : http://mashable.com/2016/06/30/apple-concert-photos-patent/#QuIcQoR0WPq8


Also : http://pigeonsandplanes.com/2016/06/apple-is-working-to-block-iphones-from-taking-photos-at-concerts/


Archive : http://9to5mac.com/2016/06/28/apple-patent-infra-red-block-photos/


Camera police? Apple might soon make it possible to block recording video at concerts

https://www.rt.com/usa/349040-apple-disable-iphone-cameras/



Image
User avatar
Jetranger
Major
Major
 
Posts: 3232
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2011 2:49 am
Location: Kansas City Missouri USA / KMKC

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby ViperPilot » Fri Jul 01, 2016 10:18 am

So far, I've found that a Smartphone is only as invasive as the amount you let it. It's only as 'smart' as the Information you let it collect about your habits, movements, and actions. The less Personal Info you input into your Smartphone (CC #'s, other Account #'s, etc.), the less chance someone will try and filch your Data.

Although many might disagree, your Smartphone isn't a mini "Ann Landers"... why are you using it (text, etc.) to broadcast your most intimate and personal Trials and Tribulations to anyone and everyone? Again... if you don't want everyone to know everything, then it's incumbent on you to 'curb your tongue' and not say the first thing that comes to mind, or run and post it on Facebook (otherwise known as the 'Online High School Drama Place'). Loose Lips Sink Ships, you know...

Lastly... most agree that the best way to record Audio at a Concert is to plug into the Soundboard (if you've got the creds, or the 'inside track')!

Alan :ugeek:
User avatar
ViperPilot
Captain
Captain
 
Posts: 724
Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2010 2:07 pm
Location: 35CO Denver, CO USA

Re: FBI and Apple - The facts

Postby OldAirmail » Fri Jul 01, 2016 8:15 pm

Webb wrote:
OldAirmail wrote: This was not a case where the FBI said that they want to look at everyone's phone records.

Unfortunately, it was.

The government wanted to establish the precedent that it could force software writers to provide "back doors" to defeat their own security.

No need to worry, though. We know how good the government is at keeping secrets. This hack would have been public information within hours.

If you don't know what the government found on the phone, it was nothing, zero, zip, zilch - which everyone expected.

"It is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer" - William Blackstone


Sorry, Jim. A judge must be convinced that there is probable cause before issuing a search warrant. You know that far better than I.

If a judge is convinced that that there is sufficient evidence of pedophilia, or other crime, then a warrant can be issued to search someone's home, computer, etc. Why are iPhone's more sacrosanct?

Are you saying that judges shouldn't issue warrants? Or that that warrants can be ignored if a person/organization/company disagrees with the order.

They can be fought by someone as powerful as Apple. But Apple went beyond that.



"The government wanted to establish the precedent that it could force software writers to provide "back doors" to defeat their own security."

And what was the FBI asking? I printed a quote from the ARS Technica article -
The iPhone requires that its firmware have a digital signature that authentically demonstrates that the firmware was developed by Apple and has not been subsequently modified. The FBI does not have (and is not asking for) access to Apple's signing key. It is instead asking for Apple to use its signing key to sign the custom firmware so that the iPhone will accept it and run it. It is this signature requirement that means the FBI cannot create the software itself.

It's this same requirement that also means that iPhone users would be safe even if the special firmware leaked. Changing the embedded unique identifier within the special firmware would break the signature and thus cause targeted iPhones to reject the firmware.
This is why complying with the court demand would not jeopardize the security of any other phones. The cryptographic safeguards don't allow it.

I thought that ARS stated it fairly.



"No need to worry, though. We know how good the government is at keeping secrets. This hack would have been public information within hours."

So.
You say that the government DID gain assess.
Perhaps you could direct me to this open secret that was leaked from the government? Google seems unable to find it. Yahoo, maybe?



In simply quoting Blackstone's formulation you may lead people to disregard the possible repercussions based on the severity of a crime/s.

The X>one formulation is fine for minor crimes. Ten guilty shoplifters erroneously let go will harm society very little, all things considered.

But, in this case, the failure of a company to comply with a justifiable warrant could have lead to more deaths than those in San Bernardino.

Then too, we have a corollary to Blackstone's formulation - No one should be convicted of a crime least they be innocent.



If we're tossing out quotes - Arnaud Amalric (died 1225) isn't as well remembered as Blackstone, even though more people will recognize something attributed to him.

He's remembered for supposedly advising a soldier, who was worried about killing orthodox Catholics instead of just heretic Cathars prior to the sack of Béziers, to simply kill everyone as God would sort it all out later. (Wiko.)



"If you don't know what the government found on the phone, it was nothing, zero, zip, zilch - which everyone expected."

That sound like a justification for your point of view. Unfortunately it's spurious. Until the information was actually looked at, any assumptions by you, or anyone else, was simple speculation.
.. .
Get the most out of your controls - SPAD.neXt

Image
. . . . . .Any time, any plane, any weather.
. . . . . . . . . . . . . Prepar3d V4
User avatar
OldAirmail
Major
Major
 
Posts: 4814
Joined: Sun Feb 17, 2013 3:06 pm
Location: Concrete, WA ICAO - 3W5

Previous

Return to General Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 281 guests