The "new" flight sim *GAME*?

[OldAirmail]

Although this is about Prepar3d, I think that most people will find it interesting.

It seems that there's a company that makes a flight sim. One that isn't supposed to be used as a game.

What's interesting is that they've announce a partnership with Saitek, a company that makes add-ons for games.


Hmmmm

Lots to think about there.


One thing that doesn't require much thinking, is the Saitek X-55 Rhino in the first video. I WANT ONE!

The reason that it doesn't take much thinking, other than wanting one, is the price - $200.

Oh well.


At least Saitek is supposed to create new drivers for P3d. They might work for FSX too.

[Jetranger]

Geshhhh all those FIXES and updates & corrections, now I see why the Forum boards of Flight sims are so full of Questions in regards to problems , I'd never of guessed !

[pete]

'Not for entertainment' is purely a legal thing that MS insisted on to allow the window to remain open for MS to go back into this FS entertainment field in the future if they decided to - + LM are not interested in supporting an entertainment platform - with all the crap and overheads of support etc that goes with that. They are in the business of flight - proper grown up flight.

BUT -- it doesn't mean you can't buy P3D and use it in whatever way you want.

A Piper PA28 wasn't built for entertainment but -- it is used all the time for just that. If you own it - you can use it for whatever purpose you want provided you aren't hurting anyone.

[OldAirmail]

Quite true.

At the moment, I think that LM is treating the large number of people who are obviously using it "for entertainment" as beta testers.

If you go to the Prepar3d support site, you'll see that they aren't discouraging the "gamers" at all.


After the MS Flight fiasco I think that it'll be a long time before any Microsoft exec decides to try it again.

[Modlerbob]

So, if I am happy with FSX as entertainment software am I correct in assuming prepar3d will not provide any significant improvement to my enjoyment of recreational flight sim flying?

[Rocket_Bird]

I think it depends on what you want out of your sim. Some people claim P3D gives a performance boost, since it reroutes how the sim handles data from the CPU to the graphics chip. I never had such luck personally, though that is largely in due to the fact that I run dual graphics, and P3D is not supporting that, thus I get worst performance in P3D.

P3D has nice shadow effects that are lacking in FSX unless you get Steve's DirectX 10 fixer, I believe.

P3D seems to have some neat looking water and some new fog effects, though unlike FSX, it lacks a real-time weather engine.

Personally I have mixed feelings towards P3d. It seems to have a bit of an identity crisis in terms of how it is used, and thus it has a steep price tag. I have little doubt some payware addon companies may raise their prices quite an amount too because of this.

If you are happy with FSX, I doubt getting P3D will make you happier unless performance is dragging you down, and you really really want shadows. At the heart of it, P3D is just FSX with a few perks to it, and a few drawbacks as well.

[zswobbie1]

I think it depends on what you want out of your sim. Some people claim P3D gives a performance boost, since it reroutes how the sim handles data from the CPU to the graphics chip. I never had such luck personally, though that is largely in due to the fact that I run dual graphics, and P3D is not supporting that, thus I

This confuses me a bit.. WE comparing a new program with one thats about 5 years old? FSX having a real-time engine?
P3D having an identity crisis? HUH?
FSX=5 years old, development long stopped, sold as a game, in gaming stores & produced by ACES Gaming Studios that has been long shut down
P3D= New, based on ESP, Microsoft's professional version off FSX, sold NOT FOR ENTERTAINMENT by Lockheed Martim, & has been upgraded about 5x & is under constant development.
It is obvious, or should be to anyone who has read the forums out there, that P3D is more than a perked up FSX.

Happy with FSX? I should not think so... FSX is the 'Vista' of Flight Sims. I dumped FSX for P3D on my Laptop.. a vast difference.
Having said all that, I still fly FS9 as well as a regressed version called Golden Wings.

A steep price tag for P3D? For the Academic version?

[Rocket_Bird]

To each his own opinion.

P3D is still largely FSX. It feels like FSX. It has more or less the same graphics as FSX. It is not, in my humble opinion, FS11. And no, apparently it doesn't come with a weather engine. You can't get real weather without a 3rd party addon. Yes, you can get a weather engine for free from some site out there, but that is beside the point.

Yes, it has an identity crisis. On the one hand, it's not for entertainment, and yet most people use it for entertainment. It has licensing issues, meaning some payware companies don't support it or will have to go through hurdles to do so. Heck, most people including you and I don't technically even meet the licensing requirements. We just buy it as though it is the next great thing and because we can.

Sure, one benefit is that the engine has been updated. It now supports DirectX 11. Great. Is it more perked up than FSX? Some areas yes, some areas no. Let's be clear here, I think there are some things that P3D does well. That said, it's not exactly an FSX overhaul either. It certainly doesn't contain that many missions, if you are into that sort of thing. I don't recall it having a training syllabus like FSX. While you might not care for that sort of thing, in the end, it adds value to the product. Because it still feels and more or less looks like FSX, the bang for buck goes to FSX IMO.

The Academic license is 59.95. After paying 59.95, you are left with a watermark on the top right corner of the screen that says Academic license. For $200, you can get rid of that watermark. That's what I call a steep price tag. Yeah, the watermark isn't a big deal, but there is certainly tons you can do with 59.95. FSX nowadays is half the price, and I argue, they ain't all that much different.

The fact that Prepar3d is "not for entertainment" and has the Lockheed Martin logo on it doesn't necessarily mean it's all that perked up and is a professional simulator (even though the simulator is intended to be marketed to professionals). As a real pilot, I know what planes should feel like. I've been on professional simulators that don't feel anywhere close to the real thing. P3D feels like FSX. Your aircraft slips on the runway just the same as it does in FSX. The departure from FSX isn't that much. It still uses old code. Yeah it has some upgrades, but if FSX is 5 years old, then P3D is still using 5 year old technology even though they've developed some aspects of it.

Not to put you down on your purchase. If you enjoy P3D, I'm not here to persuade you otherwise, so no need to go defensive. Enjoy it. I can agree,
it's a good sim in it's own right (and I'm sure you feel it is a good sim). I just don't consider it revolutionary, and I'm also not going to tell people it is just because I pitched 59.95 into it.

[zswobbie1]

OK. I consider it evolutionary, not revolutionary.

To each his own, as you say. A feint watermark really does not bother me, I'm having too much fun flying!

[Modlerbob]

I don't regard most flight sims as being "games", Entertainment yes but not really a game unless you mess with some of the arcade style sims like the latest online games like "world of warplanes".

I see prepar3D as a serious flight training tool for those who aspire to fly the 1:1 birds, therefore the need to push all the buttons and turn all the dials to even get a plane started. What I like about the MS flight sims is the ability for the most part to fly highly realistically or for those of us less concerned with recreating all the motions of a real flight a way to get an aircraft in the air and flying in a simpler way but without the arcade feel.

I am very happy with FSX and won't be investing in Prepar3D or Flightgear.

[WPadgett]

+1 to Rocket_Bird

+1 to Modelerbob

Have felt from the start that calling MS Flight Simulator a 'game' is a misnomer. I would have given a lot, and saved a lot!! if FS9, and hardware to run it, had been available when I was doing my pilot training.

Redbird Flight Simulations specializes in simulators for flight training. From their "Jay" desk top, which uses Prepar3D, to full motion simulators for aircraft such as Piper Meridian and the Cessna Citation Mustang, Redbird, along with all the airlines and most aviation training schools, support the value of flight simulator training. Most FBOs nearby who offer flight training have flight simulator setups in their office. MS Flight Simulator is useful in many ways for a serious flight training student. A pilot appreciates this fact more than a non pilot.

CP ASMEL Instruments

[OldAirmail]

It's wonderful how a post can grow in different directions.

I've no problem with that, it's fun to watch, it really is.



Every time my wife sees a big SUV she ALWAYS says "Why would anyone want something like that!

I no longer tell her that different people like different things for different reasons.

Where she sees BIG & UGLY, they see something totally different.



Is FS9, FSX, Prepar3d a game? Sure.

But it can also be a training tool.

It can also be an opportunity for someone with little money to learn if flying would be worth it to themselves.

It can also be a way to learn, in a MUCH more interesting way, about history and the world we live in.

It can also be....

Different people see it differently. So what's new?


My point in the posting revolved around the fact that a company producing a product "Not for entertainment" was announcing a partnership with Saitek, a company that makes add-ons for games.

I, for one, find some irony there.


Yes Prepar3d is a close descendant of FSX, but Prepar3d is in it's infancy.

The Academic license is 59.95. After paying 59.95, you are left with a watermark on the top right corner of the screen that says Academic license.

There's a watermark in the corner? I haven't noticed that for a long time. I no longer see it there.

It probably took all of one or two days before it disappeared from my consciousness.


I have seen the complaint about spending $59.95 for Prepar3d.

But really. Who hasn't spent that and much more on FSX add-ons?

Only those who didn't like FSX in the first place, I'd bet.