CFS2 Frame Rate Degradation

[Hugh A. Shaffer]

When running CFS2 under Win XP Home, I'm seeing a degradation is frame rates over time from 77 fps  to as low as 4 fps as a mission progresses. This occurs in missions with lots of AI aircraft and usually takes a while before it becomes noticeable.  In QC or missions with only a few AI aircraft, this degradation doesn't seem to happen, or it is so gradual as to not be noticable (77 to 66 fps consistently).  Changing scenery complexity doesn't have much, if any, effect. I think the problem is in XP. Does anyone out there have any ideas what could be causing this??

[BHOFMX]

You should try running
the FR a little lower to
start with, it may be a
heating problem,

Bhofmx

[_526th_Fireman]

Hugh, gonna need at least a few system specs in order to help you out. How much RAM, Vid Card installed etc.

And let me ask this. In those missions where there are a lot of AI acft. and you experience fps degredation, do the fps go back up when the AI fly off or get far away?

[Hugh A. Shaffer]

My system is a Dell 4550 2.0 GHz Pentium 4 w/ 512 MB RAM 60GB Hard drive@7200RPM Gforce MX420 w/64 MB memory DirectX 9.0a and Win XP Home.

As AI aircraft go away (shot down or otherwise) the frame rate continues to decline (ar at least stabilize). I once finished a mission and tried to do a carrier landing at about 4 fps - it wasn't pretty! When I start the next mission, frame rates are right back up to nomal, and then they degrade as time & aircraft go on. But it never picks back up againw/o a new mission.

[_526th_Fireman]

Well, you got a strong enough system to run it in although I know very little about XP. Wife has it and no likee. But am learning it and gathering info for tweaking it.
First, I am going to ask one more thing. Do you have a good sound card installed or is it what come with the computer? If it's what came with the computer, then it will be the integrated sound which ain't no good for gaming. That small bottle necked integrated sound system still has to process some intensive sound and just gets behind, soooo, everything slows down to wait for the sound to catch up.
When I fist installed CFS2 about 2 1/2 yrs ago, it played very slow. Went and got a nice Vid card and more RAM. Still played the same. If I remember right, it was the same thing as yours, but started out just barely ok and then went to worse.
Know what it was? It was a sound issue. Bought a Sound Blaster Live X Gamer sound card and some decent Altec Lansing speakers and no more problems.
I have had others tell me that they have put a good graphics card in and have plenty of RAM, but no sound card and they too have trouble. I guess, just through dumb luck and little history, I have come to realize that CFS2 is ALSO a sound intensive card. I bet CFS1 would play fine on your machine. But CFS2 won't. That's what happened with me and my wifes XP will play CFS1 fine with just integrated graphics and sound and not much RAM. CFS2 is a whole different story.
I suggest that if you are using the integrated sound system that came with the comp. that you go buy a Sound Blaster or Turtle Beach sound card and some nice speakers. Makes gaming and music so much nicer.
Now Sound Blaster will cost a tad more as they have all the "Extra" stuff such as the sound effects and more. The Turtle Beach cards generally cost less because they don't or at least have cards that do not have the "Frills".
Either is relatively inexpensive.
From what I can tell, a sound card is all you need.
Hope the info helps and good luck to you. Keep us posted as to how it turns out.

[_526th_Fireman]

UPDATE!! Andy has been emailing me and we have been working on the problem. Turns out he does have a Sound card installed.

I suggested the other culprit could be the MX420 VID card. Having him now go check for latest drivers for VID, Sound cards and checking latest updates for XP.

I bet he installed V2 of CFS2. Seems to be a lot of problems associated with that release for some reason. Or am I just imagining this?  ::)

[Professor Brensec]

Just as a matter of interest, Fireman.

I have a pretty low end Compac - 766Mhz, 192 Mb Ram, Intergrated Intel graphics and, surprisingly, a Soundblaster which is the only decent component that came with it.
I have the same problems as our friend in so far as, when playing CFS2, the game gradually slows to a point after 2 hrs or so where it can't be played.
It handles a good load and amount of AI and scenery to begin with but declines as time passes.
However, if I start the game again, a short time after, it is still slow. I have to wait a couple of hours to get the best speed back.

I know this is mainly the intergrated graphics, but I also realise some more RAM and more powerful processor would also make a difference.
I'll update when the time (and the finances) are right.

With regard to the sound card issue, though, I use a P.C. at work that is a bit more powerful than mine (1.4 Ghz 256 Mb Ram Rage pro 120 BUT it has NO sound card at all. I get a message everytime I install that I have to play without sound.
This machine handles CFS2 all night long (12 hours) without a breather, at top settings, and has frame rates and graphics that I only dream of for my P.C.

So it was always my assumption that the quality (or lack of) a sound card wouldn't affect the performance. I suppose, as you say, it depends on a lot of things.

If I had your P.C. Hugh, with all that power and ram and the 64mb graphics card (compared to my intergrated card which "boasts" up to 11 mb from total system memory), I would be extremely uptight if it didn't chew up CFS2 and spit it out, without effort.

That's only my lowly opinion based on the fact that, as I said, the P.C. I use at work will go all night on full settings, and has only half the power of your PC and a less powerful Graphics card.

Hope this sheds some light or helps with a comparison to refer to. I hope I haven't completely confused the issue............lol

[_526th_Fireman]

Hi brensec,

I think the integrated sound they are using now is much better technology then what was put into mine. The problem I incurred was after getting more RAM, a good graphics card and still had the slow fps and  and stuttering in the sound. After I installed my SB card, problem fixed. This is what led me to suggest to Andy it might be his sound card.

Andy emailed me back. He is going to be extremely busy this weekend and would be Mon. or so before he could get back to tracking down his problem. Hopefully, it will just be a matter of updating drivers to get him up to acceptable and steady frame rates. We will see.

Your machine is by no means too old or slow for CFS2.
Mine is a Compaq 800 MHz, 640 MB of SDRAM, a 64 MB ATI Radeon 8500 and a Sound Blaster X Gamer Live card. Now take a look at this picture, settings maxed out and with cloud layers set in Advanced Weather.

[Professor Brensec]

Thanks for the info and suggestions Mate. I'll definitley take a look at your Page, and get that Cacheman.

My biggest problem, I think, is RAM. 192Mb just isn't enough when I'm trying to run an integrated card with it also.
The reason I haven't installed more RAM is that I have had trouble finding the right strips. They are a "special' type for mine. But I can get them now , they're just a bit pricey. As soon as I get 384 or 512, I think I'll be fine as far as CFS2 is concerned.

I think the Intel Graphics card I have (82810E) is not bad for what it is. It's true that it does stop me from running well at high settings or with heaps of AI, but if I want to get a screen shot or some thing like that, the frame rates don't matter.
I'm still trying to figure if it's worth $130 to get a Geforce MX440 or similar and the extra RAM and have my CFS2 going really well (especially after some serious tweaking), or waiting till I get a bigger PC because I don't know how CFS3 will run with this PC and the above improvements.
But then, I suppose I'll have the Geforce to go with whatever bigger system I get the PC man to "knock-up" for me.
(I've told the Mrs if she even mentions the word "package" in front of me when we are considering a bigger PC, I'll throttle her...........lol) I'll get the local PC man to build one to suit OUR needs and utilise what I already have that's useful.

Thanks Again  ;D

[_526th_Fireman]

Hi brensec,

I hear what you are saying. Tough to decide about upgrading or just putting that money back and getting a bigger machine. Me, I wll have to settle for this one for a time to come. So far, CFS2 and FS2k2 play just fine on it. CFS3?! I am leaving that one alone until much later.

Have you heard of a TV show here in America called Tech TV? http://www.techtv.com Look for the Screen Savers (Name of the show) on their homepage.  They should still have this up somewhere. Patrick Norton and Leo Leporte are two brilliant guy when it comes to this stuff. They built and listed the components for a "Super Gaming Machine". They are big into games too. Anyway, case and components only totaled $500. But listen, these guys only put the components in that delivered the performance, and it didn't have to be the most expensive or latest piece of hardware. Benchmarks on it the latest Quake game put these  2 and 3 thousand dollar machines to shame. I was impressed.

Might want to check it out.

Good luck

[Hugh A. Shaffer]

Fireman-
I just downloaded your "Tweaking Guide" and it looks like I have my work cut out for me this weekend.  So far, with all the other things we've tried, the frame rates have improved (stayed a little higher), but the degradation keeps occuring.  I might see if Cashman can help. I'll also try some of the other suggestions in your "Guide"...  And the saga continues.  I do apprecaite the help.

[_526th_Fireman]

HI bud.

I am glad to hear that some progress has been made. I will tell you this, the sites that I listed will sure help any system perform better, whether you are gaming or just running applications. Your's might be in the way your comp. is set up, page filing issue, maybe even some bad or dirty memory sticks leaking memory. I have seen that one talked about here too. Guy tried everything and then someone suggested he try buying some new sticks of memory. He did and problem solved. Turns out his cheap sticks of RAM were leaking like a submarine with screen doors for hatches.

[Professor Brensec]

Sorry Fireman,

Haven't been back to this page for ages. I've been a bit busy setting up a web project over the last couple of weeks (and I've still got a ways to go!...... ).

Thanks for the link to the TV site - Interesting!

I'll be doing something similar when and if I ever get to actually update. I'll have the PC bloke that has a shop near me (good bloke, good advice, good prices), make up something to suit both my gaming and web business needs. (It'll probably end up twice as good and only half the price of a "similar" package.
As far as the packages go that the PC companies put together over here - they should be shot for the lousy graphics cards, sound cards, chips etc that they use.
They advertise their "great new Powerful" home systems for nearly $3,000 and all you get is,......say, a low end GeForce (no more than 64mb maybe even only 32mb) with 256 Ram and they make it sound like it's the greatest 'package' ever put together because it has a large size Monitor and 40 or 60 Gb hard drive.
I know some people need alot of disc space but some people (many I know) think it's the rod by which to measure what you're getting!
I've never needed anymore than 10 Gb of space for both my business and gaming needs and I don't recall seeing a so called 'package' with less than 20 lately (and that's usually with integrated graphics and only 128 Mb Ram). They're still asking $1600 or $1700 for it, and people are paying it too.

I wonder why they seem to think that disc space is the most important aspect, to the point where they make it stand out as the "BIG" selling point.
Do they do the same thing there? Or in the UK. Or are we the only 'suckers'........lol

[Hagar]

I think it's the same everywhere - depends where you go. I would never buy a machine from the popular "high street" outlets or PC supermarkets. They cater for a different market, usually the poor sods who know nothing about computers. If you know what you want, get something made up to your own specs by a reliable company, like the local guy you mention. In my experience they give a much better after-sales service too.

A 60 GB HD is quite normal these days (or even 80 GB). They're comparatively cheap & you can never have enough memory. Mine is 40 GB & almost full. I need to get another HD or start removing some junk.

[Professor Brensec]

Hey Fireman,

I also had a read of your tweaking guide.
It's very good. Thanks for taking the time to do it.
I haven't seen all of your page, but I'll get to it as soon as I get a spare moment.
All I have to do is get a graphics card now, so I can do all that tweaking............lol
I think I will go for 64Mb GeForce, I can get one for about $120 (maybe cheaper 2nd hand if I can come across one). That, and some more Ram, should get me somewhere up where your quality is.

Thanks Again  ;D