05-05-05 tidbit

[Hyperion2]

We really don't have a two party system.  The two common parties seem to produce the only legitimate candidates, but you've always got the Green Party, etc....but they don't reflect a very large portion of society, which is why they're not as big.  It's working exactly the way it's supposed to.

Plus, most Democrats aren't the Michael Moore/Ted Kennedy type...they're an entirely different breed of Democrat....

[Felix/FFDS]

I must point out that the Liberal Democrat party, the third choice, has never been in power. So we do effectively have just a two party system.

Point of information, the Liberal Democrats of today trace their history to the Liberal Party founded about 150years ago.    Although for (about) the past 80 years the PMs have been Conservatives or Labour, the Liberals were the party in power for most of the first 20 years of the 20th Century.  

David Lloyd George was the PM during most of WW1.

Winston Churchill "broke ranks" and at an early point he was part of the Liberal Party.

[denishc]

 It dawned on me that with a multi-party system its possible for a canditate can be elected without carring a majority of the populace.  So perhaps a two party system isn't bad after all.

[Felix/FFDS]

[quote]

[Woodlouse2002]

In the parliamentary system, (please correct me if I'm wrong) I understand that if a party does NOT have the required majority, the head of state (in this case the Queen?) calls upon a respected MP to form a coalition government.

In this case it would be a hung parliament and another general election would be held to clear it all up.

It dawned on me that with a multi-party system its possible for a canditate can be elected without carring a majority of the populace.  So perhaps a two party system isn't bad after all.

As for your comment denishc, forgive me for bringing this up, and even more so if it's wrong, but it's my belief that G.W. Bush in the 2000 election got 49% of the vote. Proving that no form of democracy is without fault.

[Woodlouse2002]

[quote]


Point of information, the Liberal Democrats of today trace their history to the Liberal Party founded about 150years ago.

[Hagar]

But the Liberal party of old and the Liberal Democrat party are two very different animals.

The same could be said for "New Labour". It bears no resemblance to the traditional Labour party.

[Felix/FFDS]

The same could be said for "New Labour". It bears no resemblance to the traditional Labour party.

Of course, we could say the same thing here in the US ...  Today's Republican and Democratic Parties barely, if at all, resemble their early 20th century incarnations...

[Craig.]

dont worry my british friends, if things carry on as they are, it is very possible that the Lib dems could become the second party at the next election. With Brown being the most likely to run for labour they will win a 4th term no question, it would take something big to stop that. Its now a question, of the Tories sorting out their problems or they could very likely become the third party.

[Hagar]

dont worry my british friends, if things carry on as they are, it is very possible that the Lib dems could become the second party at the next election.

I'm not a political animal but I'd better keep my big trap firmly shut on what I think of that possibility.

[Hyperion2]

As for your comment denishc, forgive me for bringing this up, and even more so if it's wrong, but it's my belief that G.W. Bush in the 2000 election got 49% of the vote. Proving that no form of democracy is without fault.

Liberals are a funny breed.  No matter what the discussion, this comes up.

I needn't remind them that under the rules set forth by the electoral college system, which was established in Article II, Section 1 of the U.S. Constitution, the object of "the game" is to win 270 electoral votes.  Nowhere does it ever say you need to win a majority.

But the US is a democracy, you ask?  You'd be wrong again, my blue state donkey friend.  The United States is not, nor has it ever been a democracy.  It's a representative republic.

If you take a few moments to read an excellent document that I'll link to below, you'll understand WHY the electoral process was set up this way.  

Until then, to those of you who think you were robbed in 2000, get yourself a little steno pad and write down your gripes while you watch the next installment of the Fahrenheit 911 trilogy.

Great link:  http://www.fec.gov/pdf/eleccoll.pdf

[Felix/FFDS]

You'd be wrong again, my blue state donkey friend.

Woody is a Brit, not a "blue state donkey friend"....


BTW - Very nice link ...

Another intersting (for me) link is:

http://uselectionatlas.org/

[denishc]

[quote]I needn't remind them that under the rules set forth by the electoral college system, which was established in Article II, Section 1 of the U.S. Constitution, the object of "the game" is to win 270 electoral votes.

[Hagar]

Woody is a Brit, not a "blue state donkey friend"....

Quite right. Someone seems to be jumping to conclusions again. Not only that but calling someone a donkey doesn't sound too complimetary to me.

I expect Woody's as confused about US politics as I am - & no doubt most Americans are with how it's done on this side of the old puddle. Heck, that even confuses me. I have no idea of his political leanings but blue is the colour of the Conservative party so a True Blue would be a die-hard Conservative. If he's anything like me he's wary of all politicians, no matter which side of the fence they happen to be on. They're all tarred with the same brush & we tend not to take our politics too seriously over here.

As a matter of interest, Blair's New Labour party was returned to power on something like 36% of the vote, meaning that 64% of people that actually voted didn't vote for New Labour.

[Felix/FFDS]

Quite right. Someone seems to be jumping to conclusions again. Not only that but calling someone a donkey doesn't sound too complimetary to me.
.

Traditionally, the Democratic Party in the US is characterized by a donkey symbol, with an elephant representing the Republican Party.