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A jump plane leased out to Skydive Snohomis has possibly crashed in the Cascades late last night.

Sad News Indeed.

I heard about this on the news this morning. Was wondering exactly in Washington this was as I fly there most of the time in FS. With your post, you have certainly cleared it up.

They said on the news that it was foggy with light rain and an eyewitness saw the aircraft fly overhead at a low altitude but could not really see it in the fog. A few seconds later he heard it crash in the fog...


Dave

The plane has been found, no survivors [smiley=sad.gif]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7035047.stm

..including details of Sky dive accidents elsewhere in the World.

F.... 8-)...!

This may be a stupid question and with all due respect,
If they were skydivers, why didn't they put on their parachutes and jump?

That's a good question, but from the information in the last radar contacts, sounds like once they knew something was wrong, it was completely too late.  A 7,000 fpm change in altitude is quite significant.  I've flown in 430A (the airplane in the accident) and we peg that VSI at 3000 fpm descents once the jumpers are out.  I couldn't see any way anyone could climb out of the airplane at that attitude.  Plus it was at night, and the airplane was over some very high mountains.  (crash site was at 4,300 feet!)

So far all the people they've spoken about or shown on TV are friends of mine.  

Posted by: Boss_BlueAngels Posted on: Yesterday at 6:15pm
That's a good question

I was thinking last night that maybe it was inappropriate but I had only posted what was on my mind not taking into consideration how high they were etc..
Please keep us informed and once again, sorry for the tragic news...

Dave

I've been watching it on the local news. A sad unfortunate tragedy...

Thank you all so much for your support.  It really means a lot to me.

Dave, I don't think it was inappropriate at all.  It's a good question, that was the first thing I thought as well.  They jump out of the stupid thing when it's fine, but stay with it when it's going down.  
Well I've ridden in that same airplane and they do 13,500 foot jumps anytime the weather permits, so jumping from that altitude is no problem.  (Gives a full minute of free fall!)

I'm doing better now that I have the official list of those in the accident.  As you could imagine, that business has a lot of employees and regular customers.  

Phil Kibler (pilot), Ralphie Abdo, Landon Atkin, Michelle Barker, Casey Craig, Cecil Elsner, Bryan Jones, Jeff Ross, Hollie Raspberry, and Andy Smith.

One thing I can't get out of my mind is the memories of sitting in that airplane cleaning it, laughing at all of the funny stickers the jumpers put inside the main cabin. lol  It took HOURS to wash that airplane inside and out.  Making sure it looked like it was fresh from the paint shop each week.  At one point I was washing a window thinking, "if these guys had any idea how expensive this window was, they wouldn't have put this sticker on it!"  And then I remember those flights I was able to go up and how excited the people always were in the back.  Whether they were with students, or going up for their 1,000th jump.  Always playin' around and having a good time.  I was able to ride up with each of the people in that list.  They were all so nice to be around and always encouraging.  

I just hope that once the NTSB is able to determine the cause of this accident actions can be made to make sure it doesn't happen again.  

So now I have a little bit of closure at least.  Now it's time to deal with things and get back in the saddle.  This isn't the first time I've lost a friend in an aviation accident and was hoping it was something that gets easier.

One thing I can't get out of my mind is the memories of sitting in that airplane cleaning it, laughing at all of the funny stickers the jumpers put inside the main cabin. lol  It took HOURS to wash that airplane inside and out.  Making sure it looked like it was fresh from the paint shop each week.  At one point I was washing a window thinking, "if these guys had any idea how expensive this window was, they wouldn't have put this sticker on it!"  And then I remember those flights I was able to go up and how excited the people always were in the back.  Whether they were with students, or going up for their 1,000th jump.  Always playin' around and having a good time.  I was able to ride up with each of the people in that list.  They were all so nice to be around and always encouraging.

Touching & real memories...

The only thing that makes any stense to me is hypoxia.  It's the only thing that explains everything in the accident, why nobody got out, the 360's before impact, high rate of descent, and the fact that the tail section of the aircraft was found in a completely different area from the rest of the wreckage.

They're flying around 13,000 feet for probably just over an hour at that point.  They could have fallen asleep, the ariplane starts to slowly turn and descend, then it keeps getting steeper, faster, and it exceeds Vne tail comes off in a 7000+ FPM spiraling descent.  

But, that's just a theory and I'm certianly no expert.

This may be a stupid question and with all due respect,
If they were skydivers, why didn't they put on their parachutes and jump?

Easy answer - because it was probably impossible.

I've had to bail out from a damaged aircraft only once, at an event in Illinois.  During jump run (i.e. when everyone was preparing to jump) someone's parachute deployed in the door.  Parachute went over the tail, he went under.  It felt like the plane had hit a wall; it suddenly pitched down 30 degrees and slowed dramatically.

Now, in this situation, everyone had their parachutes on and was ready to exit.  The door was open.  I yelled "parachute over the tail!  Bail out!" so they knew what was going on.  It _still_ took 30 seconds or so to get everyone to understand what was happening, and get them up the slope to the door (which was in the back.)  And this was with skydivers ready to exit; the only oddity was a slope they had to climb up.

Now translate that to what likely happened here.  A plane was packed with jumpers and their gear - and if anyone has flown in a Caravan, they know that 10 people in that plane is a little cozy.  It was dark out, and for at least part of the flight they were in the clouds.  At some point the plane began to spiral, which means G's.  The odds of finding your gear, in the dark, and getting it on with 8 other people trying to do the same, while pulling 2 G's are pretty low.

Also keep in mind that the pilot was likely still trying to fly his way out of the problem, and would have probably started yelling at anyone who tried to open the door while he was trying to solve the problem of being in IMC at night over mountains.

There have been a few cases like this where people HAVE bailed out, but it's generally a close thing.  In one case, a pilot had the tail torn off his Cessna 206.  He had his parachute on, the door was open, it was right next to him and he knew exactly what was happening.  He _still_ barely made it out in time; he exited the plane at 1000 feet, which is about five seconds from impact (and about two seconds from being too late to open a parachute.)

So generally unless you are ready to go and are expecting to exit, the odds of being able to use that parachute in an aircraft emergency are pretty low.

Thanks Billvon for the details....
Your comments are appreciated.

Dave