Valid arguments against the Typhoon (go America!)

[C]

[quote]
I

[beefhole]

In the end though, Charlie, those were all still US operations, flown primarily by US planes, and overseen by US personnel.  My argument is how nobody does infrastructure better-who do you think moves the blips around? Who manages all this?  There's no argument here, it's all been under US command.

I was making no argument about US being better AA, although we have many more fighters than the UK does (both in different types and overall numbers), all that does is make us more capable-not necissarily any better.  I still think the F/A-18 kicks ass though

The point I'm making isn't the US being in more wars, it's the US has had much more practice fighting modern air wars on a mass scale-EVERYTHING I've been saying has been directed at my very first post, where I argue that nobody really does overall management of an air war as well as the US does, because we "have that **** cold".  It doesn't matter what nationality the tanker was that US pilots decided to go to, who was moving the blips around?  That's all I mean.

[Craig.]

In the end, i'll take the opinion of the guy whos ass is in the seat of one of her majestys planes, over anyone elses.

[C]

[quote]

[JBaymore]

My argument is how nobody does infrastructure better-who do you think moves the blips around? Who manages all this? There's no argument here, it's all been under US command.

Beefhole,

Hum....... realtive to the above...... I would like to know what first hand experiences you have had with the US Air Force (or other US military aviation branch), as well as your expereinces with the military aviation branches of say Britian, Israel, Russia, Austrailia, Germany, France and maybe other countries upon which you base your obviously strident comments?

best,

.....................john

[beefhole]

Beefhole,

Hum....... realtive to the above...... I would like to know what first hand experiences you have had with the US Air Force (or other US military aviation branch), as well as your expereinces with the military aviation branches of say Britian, Israel, Russia, Austrailia, Germany, France and maybe other countries upon which you base your obviously strident comments?

best,

.....................john

The friend I referred to in my first post.  He's with the 49th MAG and Marine Intel, so he is right there with everything.  One of his jobs is teaching pilots how our system works, and how the systems of our allies and enemies works.  Just about every word I've typed has been from his mouth-I'll try to state it simply one more time.

We've had more practice.  That's it.  That' the base line of what I'm saying.  We've been taking notes since Vietnam, and that collaboration has lead to a highly tuned air war machine.  Even if other countries could do it just as well, we still have more experience with this specific facet of warfare.  We have the political muscle to force ourselves into a command position? Fine, whatever.  That still means that it's the US personnel that are the ones racking up the experience.  This is my only point.

Britian, Israel, Russia, Austrailia, Germany, France

They haven't fought an air war with hundreds of planes in the air at once, all coordinating through eachother and a CP within the last fifteen years (and for a few of them, longer)

Is that somewhat clearer now?

[C]

They haven't fought an air war with hundreds of planes in the air at once, all coordinating through eachother and a CP within the last fifteen years (and for a few of them, longer)

Is that somewhat clearer now?

Look up COMAO, and you'll see that most of the nations were involved in the very same operations...

[beefhole]

While COMAO looks like it's about as close as you can get, my original statement is still true

[Felix/FFDS]

Let me try to make some sense out of this argument.


#1 - The US has had more "hands on" experience in large scale operations since the end of WW2.

#2 - The US has had more resources - material and personnel - to carry out the operations (see #1).

#3 - The US has had the political clout to make itself the lead in said operations (as well as being the main bankroller)

#4 - The US has developed more command and control systems and experience to carry out large operations.

#5 - Given the above, this is not to say that other nations are not as good (or better) than the US in specific areas/limited operations, and a good argument can be made that systems/tactics/equipment first developed elsewhere have been adopted and adapted for US use (ex.  Canberra, Harrier, Hawk, and a host of others)

Basically, the US is "better" in the sense that they have more resources and money to spend, and have had more opportunities to be in action.

No, I have not been in the military, and my sole qualification to making these statements is old age, and (hopefully) an analytical mind.

And if we're going to drop names, I know a fellow that works in the Office of the Director of Marine Intelligence in Washington DC.

[C]

And if we're going to drop names, I know a fellow that works in the Office of the Director of Marine Intelligence in Washington DC.

Is he related to you Felix or is my memory wandering elsewhere?

[SilverFox441]

The Isrealis are actually the best...

Bekaa Valley, 'nuff said.

If you want to go by the standard of "lessons learned" in combat...then Syria, Jordan and Egypt would all rate higher than western forces...although they learned their lessons (assuming they were learned) the hard way.

[C]

I have no idea which air force is "the best" and I don't much give a damn but no-one has tried to develope their argument here and all that has happened is alot of repetition.

Quite simply because ther isn't a "best" air force. As the latest RAF slogan says though, "Person for person, Pound for Pound, second to none". The RAF, along with all the UK armed forces is used to punching above its weight with its minimal (thanks to several government) resources...

[Hagar]

As the latest RAF slogan says though, "Person for person, Pound for Pound, second to none".

Hooray for the RAF.......! Jolly good show. I have always believed that & nobody can persuade me otherwise.

I wouldn't expect Beefy to agree. It's perfectly natural that we all think our Air Force is best. Just as well really.

[JBaymore]

[quote]The friend I referred to in my first post.