Oops....

[OVERLORD_CHRIS]

-when the plane stops turn the motors off.

NB. This is optional if one manages to seperate the cockpit from the rest of the aeroplane. In such cases, pick someone to volunteer. Or get one's man to do it with an adjustable spanner...

Yeah that is true, but the motors should have been in idle as soon as the plane started moving., which would have slowed them down, and given them a good chance to panic or what ever, and by the time they started to go up the wall some one should have shut down the motors to prevent it from going up and over.

[expat]

-when the plane stops turn the motors off.

NB. This is optional if one manages to seperate the cockpit from the rest of the aeroplane. In such cases, pick someone to volunteer. Or get one's man to do it with an adjustable spanner...

Yeah that is true, but the motors should have been in idle as soon as the plane started moving., which would have slowed them down, and given them a good chance to panic or what ever, and by the time they started to go up the wall some one should have shut down the motors to prevent it from going up and over.

As I pointed out in a previous post, when run ups are done or when towing, you are never strapped in. The aircraft starts to move and you stand on the brakes. Cutting the power is the next thing you do, however at brake application the aircraft stops (no ABS below 25 to 30 kts), but you carry on until you meet the windscreen at which point you stop, say awww, grab your nose or whatever you hit, fall back down and then try and find the brake pedals and the throttles again. The aircraft can travel a significant distance in that time. In my own company last week we had a towing accident. The towing arm broke and the rest is history.

A320 gets intimate with tug  (The driven was not even scratched)

In the case of the A340, the main defect was the run up it's self. All 4 engines where being run at about 80%. The AMM states that only one engine should be run at high power whilst the rest are set at idle. The brakes would never have stopped or held it in place.
A side line to this, I now never tow or run up with out the lap belts in place.

Matt

[Wii]

-when the plane stops turn the motors off.

NB. This is optional if one manages to seperate the cockpit from the rest of the aeroplane. In such cases, pick someone to volunteer. Or get one's man to do it with an adjustable spanner...

Yeah that is true, but the motors should have been in idle as soon as the plane started moving., which would have slowed them down, and given them a good chance to panic or what ever, and by the time they started to go up the wall some one should have shut down the motors to prevent it from going up and over.

As I pointed out in a previous post, when run ups are done or when towing, you are never strapped in. The aircraft starts to move and you stand on the brakes. Cutting the power is the next thing you do, however at brake application the aircraft stops (no ABS below 25 to 30 kts), but you carry on until you meet the windscreen at which point you stop, say awww, grab your nose or whatever you hit, fall back down and then try and find the brake pedals and the throttles again. The aircraft can travel a significant distance in that time. In my own company last week we had a towing accident. The towing arm broke and the rest is history.

A320 gets intimate with tug

[Willit Run]

Well, that had to hurt the old pocketbook!!

It's a shame it had to happen to an A340 and not the big ugly sister A380!!

It's a shame it had to happen at all!!!

Just glad everyone was o.k.

[OVERLORD_CHRIS]

As I pointed out in a previous post, when run ups are done or when towing, you are never strapped in. The aircraft starts to move and you stand on the brakes. Cutting the power is the next thing you do, however at brake application the aircraft stops (no ABS below 25 to 30 kts), but you carry on until you meet the windscreen at which point you stop, say awww, grab your nose or whatever you hit, fall back down and then try and find the brake pedals and the throttles again. The aircraft can travel a significant distance in that time. In my own company last week we had a towing accident. The towing arm broke and the rest is history.

A320 gets intimate with tug  (The driven was not even scratched)

In the case of the A340, the main defect was the run up it's self. All 4 engines where being run at about 80%. The AMM states that only one engine should be run at high power whilst the rest are set at idle. The brakes would never have stopped or held it in place.
A side line to this, I now never tow or run up with out the lap belts in place.

Matt

So is there some different proceeder for engine runs between: Boeing & Military vs Air Bus? Not wearing any type of restraint while running above idle is silly. My old supervisor spun a C-130 around one day while doing a power run on ice, and if he did not have his lower belt on he would have been tossed from the seat and up against the window. *break problem on one side they found out*

And since your hands are on the throttle's, and your feet are already next to the rudder/breaks, both should have been used at the same time.....But like you said they should not have not been doing a 4 engine power run against the normal operations.

[expat]

As I pointed out in a previous post, when run ups are done or when towing, you are never strapped in. The aircraft starts to move and you stand on the brakes. Cutting the power is the next thing you do, however at brake application the aircraft stops (no ABS below 25 to 30 kts), but you carry on until you meet the windscreen at which point you stop, say awww, grab your nose or whatever you hit, fall back down and then try and find the brake pedals and the throttles again. The aircraft can travel a significant distance in that time. In my own company last week we had a towing accident. The towing arm broke and the rest is history.

A320 gets intimate with tug  (The driven was not even scratched)

In the case of the A340, the main defect was the run up it's self. All 4 engines where being run at about 80%. The AMM states that only one engine should be run at high power whilst the rest are set at idle. The brakes would never have stopped or held it in place.
A side line to this, I now never tow or run up with out the lap belts in place.

Matt

So is there some different proceeder for engine runs between: Boeing & Military vs Air Bus? Not wearing any type of restraint while running above idle is silly. My old supervisor spun a C-130 around one day while doing a power run on ice, and if he did not have his lower belt on he would have been tossed from the seat and up against the window. *break problem on one side they found out*

And since your hands are on the throttle's, and your feet are already next to the rudder/breaks, both should have been used at the same time.....But like you said they should not have not been doing a 4 engine power run against the normal operations.

Everything that is done is always done in accordance with the aircraft maintenance manual. That just lays down how the task is carried out. Depending on which AMM version you buy seems to depend on whether it contains further warnings. Boeing "Technical Documents" (used by my company) are the cheapest and have very few. The Boeing PMA (portable maintenance aid), that does have warnings sometimes e.g, high voltage, wind strength etc. The best one, is Air Nav. They produce for many different aircraft. We have them for our Airbus's. They contain warnings within the (relevant) task about hight, voltage, chemicals, weather. I have never read a warning about being strapped in for engine runs in all of my time on aircraft (just entered my 21st year). That is down to common sense and lets face it, the rest of the world is lacking, why should the aircraft industry be any different.

Matt

[Hagar]

Everything that is done is always done in accordance with the aircraft maintenance manual. That just lays down how the task is carried out. Depending on which AMM version you buy seems to depend on whether it contains further warnings. Boeing "Technical Documents" (used by my company) are the cheapest and have very few. The Boeing PMA (portable maintenance aid), that does have warnings sometimes e.g, high voltage, wind strength etc. The best one, is Air Nav. They produce for many different aircraft. We have them for our Airbus's. They contain warnings within the (relevant) task about hight, voltage, chemicals, weather. I have never read a warning about being strapped in for engine runs in all of my time on aircraft (just entered my 21st year). That is down to common sense and lets face it, the rest of the world is lacking, why should the aircraft industry be any different.

I wouldn't expect this to be in a specific aircraft manual or technical document. I would have thought it would be laid down in the standard operating procedures of individual airlines/organisations & cover all types of aircraft. I imagine it comes under the heading of Health & Safety in the company QA manual. Everything else seems to nowadays. This is one example of where it makes sense.

[expat]

Everything that is done is always done in accordance with the aircraft maintenance manual. That just lays down how the task is carried out. Depending on which AMM version you buy seems to depend on whether it contains further warnings. Boeing "Technical Documents" (used by my company) are the cheapest and have very few. The Boeing PMA (portable maintenance aid), that does have warnings sometimes e.g, high voltage, wind strength etc. The best one, is Air Nav. They produce for many different aircraft. We have them for our Airbus's. They contain warnings within the (relevant) task about hight, voltage, chemicals, weather. I have never read a warning about being strapped in for engine runs in all of my time on aircraft (just entered my 21st year). That is down to common sense and lets face it, the rest of the world is lacking, why should the aircraft industry be any different.

I wouldn't expect this to be in a specific aircraft manual or technical document. I would have thought it would be laid down in the standard operating procedures of individual airlines/organisations & cover all types of aircraft. I imagine it comes under the heading of Health & Safety in the company QA manual. Everything else seems to nowadays. This is one example of where it makes sense.

As I said;
That is down to common sense and lets face it, the rest of the world is lacking, why should the aircraft industry be any different.
Often it takes an accident to change things that........"we have always done it that way and it has always worked fine". Then you have to wait for the new regs/recommendations to filter down to the people who need them. They sit in an in tray for a while and then get passed to the safety guys who have to add their input and then company approval and then location approval because an out station has different operating standards due to local factors blah, blah blah etc,etc and so one. In a couple of years it may actually make it down the line in written form and end up in my mail slot at work. In the mean time, I made the executive decision and strap myself in for run ups and towing.

Matt