outrageous gas prices whatnot.

[TacitBlue]

Now theres an idea. Methane powered cars! There could be a hose going from the drivers seat straight into the carburator!

[legoalex2000]

there was that guy who had the maneur powered car.

Jbaymore:

i'd be better off using less fuel to power a generator to fill, lets say 5 cars rather than 1 gas powered car. not to mention that we are still in the baby steps of mass production of alternative energy. we've had the technology to this stuff of decades, but oil compaines are still the dominating fuel source.

also, if an alternative fuel source (hydrogen, air, etc...) were to be a big hit, gas stations wouldnt have to go away, just change what they serve, thus keeping jobs.

Ramos

[Triple_7]

First topic of my government class today was the high gas prices.

Can't post much of the discusion without being very political so not going to bother

Basicly...The oil companies have had massive increases in profits...one was like 51% increase over the last year or so. (we are talking profits in the billions here)  Yet our gas prices continue to rise more then ever.  And then theres over here in the US at least...as part of the "energy bill" what not, going to be a few billion dollar tax break for the oil companies..."so they will invest in alternet energy sorce reserch" :-/

Is it just me, or does something something seem a bit screwy about that

not to be made into a political argument

[JBaymore]

i'd be better off using less fuel to power a generator to fill, lets say 5 cars rather than 1 gas powered car.

Ramos,

First off ....... not trying to "pick on you here.

[Hagar]

This reminds me. To overcome the serious shortage of petrol in Britain during WWII some vehicles were converted to run on gas. By gas I mean the gas Fozzer uses in his famous gas oven, not gasolene. In those days gas was extracted from coal in the local gas works. I found this photo of a London Transport bus converted to run on gas. The compressed gas is in the trailer on the back.



There weren't many private cars around but some people had their cars converted to run on gas too. This was contained in a gasbag (no not me ), usually strapped to the top of the car. When fully inflated with gas these bags were often twice the size of the car. I can't find a photo but it must have been rather like driving around under a small blimp.

[quote]My understanding is that the tax on gas is a lot higher in England and thats one of the big reasons that the price is so high.

[RichieB16]

Yes Richie, but as it's the price we (including visitors) pay at the pump it seems the only fair comparison.

Oh, I agree that it's a fair comparison-I was just asking out of curosity.  Someone (can't remember who) told me that sometime back and you guys are the only people I know who live there-so I thought I would ask.  

[commoner]

[quote]Busting bubbles used to power the pistons?

[Hagar]

Converting litres to gallons reminded me of the considerable difference between Imperial & US gallons.

10 U.S. gallons equals approximately 8.327 Imperial gallons. The Imperial gallon is about a fifth larger than the U.S. gallon, i.e. 5 Imp. gal = 6 U.S. gal.

This makes me wonder which one the car manufacturers base their mileage figures on.

[bschott]

(in my post USD means United States Dollar(s))

Well, If anyone remembers, the diesel engine was originally designed to run various fuels including coal dust.

It was proven at the 1800 world fair to run using peanut oil!

I work with an engineer who drives a diesel truck, one tank has diesel fuel, the other...has used fryer fat from McDonalds! I kid you not!

McDonalds actually PAYS HIM to take the fryer fat.  He has a strainer at home that cleans out the food particles, and then he empties the cleaned fryer fat into the second tank.

I didn't believe it until I saw it work. The dang diesel loves it.  He just switchs back to the straight diesel 3-4 minutes before he shuts down (to clean out the engine)...

He said the last time he filled the Diesel tank (15 US Gallons) was back in DECEMBER..and it is still half full.

This is an everyday vehical, and he lives 30-40 miles away.

BTW, I just filled my 13 US Gallon tank in my 1993 Pontiac Grand Am.  30USD

Gas is $2.50 per gallon here.

From what I have read, gas prices in the US would have to reach 7USD to 8USD before we would equal the 1970's gas crisis (due to inflation).

BTW, from what I have heard we have already hit and passed 'Peak Oil'...intersting to see what the next few years brings.

Just think of what higher fuel costs would bring... It's a dominoe effect.

The Trucking Companies/Transporting Companies
-They are paying more and more to move the same amount of good, so they pass that cost on to their customers

-Those Companies are like FEDEX, DHL, PHILLIPS Trucking...

So the cost of goods will increase.  Walmart is paying more in shipping costs (or fuel costs if they use their own trucks) and they pass that on to the consumers.

The cost of food will increase because the grocery stores have to pay more to the transport companys to get their goods.

The cost of packages will increase because FEDEX, UPS, DHL and the like are paying more in fuel costs to move the same amount of packages.

General aviation will see a sharp decline.  The cost to fill your aircraft's tanks with AVGAS or JP (depending on your type of aircraft) will be prohibitive to many pilots.

Airlines will start cutting back on the number of flights they make, and condense multiple flights into a particular city down to just a few.  They would do this to keep their fares reasonable, but soon they would start raising fairs.

Automotive sales will start to decline. People will drive less (because when it costs $40-$50 to fill your gas tank in the average car...or $60-$80 to fill that SUV, people will think twice) and only drive when it is nessesary.

You will see an increase in the number of 'drive offs'.  People filling their tanks with petro then driving away without paying. To counter this, Petro stations will resort to 'pre-pay' pumps only (they are doing this in my city already...if you fill after 7pm you have to prepay the pump)

The number of 'petro thefts' will increase... Theives suck the gas out of your tank at night.  Starting to happen around here already.

Public transportation will start to be limited in their routes and number of vehicals running to help conserve fuel costs.

I say, when petro starts to hit 5-6 dollars a gallon in the usa...watch out.  For some reason, my fellow American's feel it is our right to have cheep petro/gas and from the grumbling I hear now when prices are at $2.50,  if gas hits $5-$7....

I really see the sports vehical sales taking a hit.  Snow Mobiles, dirt bikes, dune buggies, jet skis...even RV sales.

I wouldn't worry about SUV's much right now.  I would say in the next few years, unless prices of gas start to fall, the SUV is going to fade really fast, and the econo cars will make it big.

I don't think we would see a marked increase in Electricity costs any time soon.  The first power plants were run on wood, while today we rely mainly on petroleum, natural gas, coal, hydroelectric and nuclear power and a small amount from hydrogen, solar energy, tidal harnesses, and wind generators.

(right from wikipedia)
The world relies mainly on coal and natural gas for power. The high capital requirements of nuclear power and the fear of its dangers have prevented the ordering of new nuclear power plants in North America since the 1970s.

Steam turbines can be powered using steam produced from geothermal sources, solar energy or Nuclear plants.

Well North Dakota, (my home state) has over 500 years worth of lignite coal available for use (right from the ND State Governments page main page..and that is concidering that coal use doesn't drastically increase)  Lignite is used almost exclusively as fuel for steam-electric power generation.  We actually overproduce electricity in our state...so we have one of the lowest Dollars per kilowatt hour costs in the nation.

(BTW on an unrealated note but something for the trivia guys: North Dakota has the only state-owned bank in the United States, the Bank of North Dakota. The bank, by law, holds all funds of all state and local government agencies in North Dakota. Its deposits are not guaranteed by the FDIC, but by the State of North Dakota itself.)

[H]

Did you know that in places like Cuba, there are people who retro-fit a bicycle with either a very small gas motor from something like a lawn mower - or an electric motor that's usually from anything that has a strong enough electric motor?
It's quite brilliant actually.
If you need to gain some speed just kick in the motor. And if you need to just casually stroll along, just pedal. And at something like nearly 90 miles to the gallon, that's pretty good competition.
However, those kind of retro-fits are usually illegal for safety reasons. One reason is that the stock brakes of the bikes are too weak to handle the speed and people tend to crash and get hurt.

Stateside (which I erroneously, evidently, thought your little corner of the world was part of ) the manufactured form of these are called mopeds.

I did some conversion... this is the result...
My little diesel-car: $ 5,15/ gal
My girlfriends pertol car: $6,42 $/gal
So excuse me if I think your still paying reasonable prices in the US...  ;D

Thus I'll revert to my comment in that thread:
Let's see; for a reference we'll use Ponceau, near the center of Belgium. My present drive to the jobsite is the least I've had since my ministerial internship (1 mile -- I walked it!) but  I'll use one of the intermediate, yet still in-state, distances traveled for an installation on my previous job. That would be about a 150 miles. One-hundred-fifty miles in any direction but west from Ponceau? You're out of the country. Going westward, also out of the country... need no fuel... car no work...blub, blub, blub...  :-X
Maybe my map is wrong

...If such a level of taxation was imposed in the U.S. you would probably see a second American Revolution.................commoner

Maybe... but we'd never get away with dumping it into the ocean

...what i want is the oxygen powered car. The french are developing it. it's a car powered by compressed air. It's the perfect solution! just stick a scuba tank to your car and go! no emmissions, it's free, it's everywhere. BAM done.
http://www.theaircar.com/ ...Ramos

I'm not sure we got the whole picture. Does this system consist of a huge air gun and you're shot out of it like a huge air pellet ? The vehicle looks sized and shaped about right for it.  ;D

... People were using motors from everything from circular saws to weed-eaters to leaf blowers. It was pretty interesting.

The weedeater one is tempting. I've an electric one but where can I find an extension cord long enough ?

...I remember many years ago (50 or 60) there was a design for "soap engine" in some magazine or other....the idea was that soap bubbles were injected into the cylinders and spark plugs were substituted by  needles ..the idea (obviously) was that bursting the bubbles gave the pistons the neccessary kick to rotate the crankshaft.........anybody old enough to remember that?......Fozz maybe. Commoner

Well, my mom would be -- but she didn't tell me about a full-size vehicle. She did, however, once give me a tiny plastic soap-operated/baking soda-operated toy submarine.

Converting litres to gallons reminded me of the considerable difference between Imperial & US gallons. This makes me wonder which one the car manufacturers base their mileage figures on.

Per their preference, the U.S. measure would provide the higher mpg .

[Hagar]

[quote]I work with an engineer who drives a diesel truck, one tank has diesel fuel, the other...has used fryer fat from McDonalds! I kid you not!

McDonalds actually PAYS HIM to take the fryer fat.

[Hagar]

Per their preference, the U.S. measure would provide the higher mpg .

I don't think so. :-/ To my way of thinking with the Imp gallon being bigger you would obviously go further on a given amount.

[TacitBlue]

I just remembered an artical in the latest National Geographic. It was all about the oil prices and alternative energy- basically what we are talking about here. I suggest you guys pick up a copy.

[H]

I don't think so. :-/ To my way of thinking with the Imp gallon being bigger you would obviously go further on a given amount.

Thought you would pick up on that but I'd checked out of here and was two miles (@3-1/4 kilometers) down the road when it dawned on me that I'd never completed my statement, which should have read:
"Per their preference, the U.S. measure would provide the higher mpg. The U.K. measure would provide the higher kpg ."
However, you could correct me on that, as well. It was my understanding that companies based figures for vehicles intended for the U.S. on miles while those on their way to the European market were based on kilometers.

**Like I've said, omissions happen when I'm pressed for time. Guess I had to prove it. Wait until I jam the ending of one sentence onto the beginning of another (yes, it's happened):P

[Hagar]

Thought you would pick up on that but I'd checked out of here and was two miles (@3-1/4 kilometers) down the road when it dawned on me that I'd never completed my statement, which should have read:
"Per their preference, the U.S. measure would provide the higher mpg. The U.K. measure would provide the higher kpg ."
However, you could correct me on that, as well. It was my understanding that companies based figures for vehicles intended for the U.S. on miles while those on their way to the European market were based on kilometers.

I've not looked at fuel consumption figures for years but we still use miles in the UK so it would probably be quoted as mpg. I would expect that to be Imperial gallons. I assume it would be kpl (kilometres per litre) in the rest of Europe. That would mean absolutely nothing to me unless it was converted.

PS. I think this confirms it. http://www.jaguar.co.uk/uk/en/vehicles/xk/specs/performance_economy.htm