Your voice on guns

[Scorpiоn]

You might like to tell that to this boy's parents. http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,3604,1312388,00.html
While you're about it tell the parents of the 13 year-old boy who was killed in a similar incident the previous week. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/devon/3649160.stm

I've heard all the same old arguments for & against private gun ownership for longer than I care to remember. These arguments will still be going on long after I depart this mortal coil, not I hope from gunshot wounds although this seems more likely now than in my whole lifetime. I won't pretend that I like guns but I know that whatever I or anyone else says won't change a single person's opinion on this subject.

Admittedly, I've never heard much about this.  From what I gather, this is one more way untalented "hunters" can cheat and give themselves an unfair advantage against animals.  Personally, I don't think sitting 30 feet in the air, camouflaged, with a high precision, flesh shattering bullet and a 3000 ft scope is a "right" way to hunt.  The scene evolves.

Like I said, I'm not very into the latest about guns, and the whole issue is so complex, I just tend to look for my own interests; to comprehend and then determine a stand on the whole thing is a gargantuan task.  I don't think people are too concerned about somebody with a rifle who only shoots at official/unofficial ranges. Hopefully, if the fight over guns moves in an anti-gun direction, I shall be dead and gone by the time my scope-less, Korean Era rifle is outlawed.

[Bazza]

Hagar's comment about the discussion raging on after he has left this "mortal coil" was the most sensible comment made so far - my own included - LOL.  IMOH.

History has shown the human race to be one of the nastiest, most dangerous species of all time  ... all we need are AK47's and a redneck attitude.............."anyone comes on my property and I'll blow him away."

Anyone ever think about emigrating to a sane society ?

[ATI_7500]

Absolutely its outdated, but that doesn't mean we can just throw it away.

An "update" would be enough.

The concept of a monarch is bit outdated, isn't it? ...[stuff about queen and such]...

The english monarchy ain't my cup o' tea,so I don't have any opinion on it.

And what happens when someone breaks into your home and shoots you in the head for trying to stop them if you don't have one?

Bad luck,I'd say.

[Loafing Smurf]

I'm leaning towards ozzys opinion on this one. In Canada you have to go through a four day course with the government to get a license to purchase and own a gun. They do a background check and ask one of your parents if they think if your responsible enough (regardless of age).

On top of that, if a gun club does not think you are responsible enough to handle a firearm, they will ban you.

I also think anybody criminal related history, should not be able to own a gun.

I also agree with Iroquois on gun related crimes in the city. There are some stupid people out there that would show off a loaded gun to their friends. Then some gangs would fire "x" amount of rounds in a neighborhood or night club trying to kill an intended victim. Then end up taking down more than they expected. Somebody told me that in Toronto, an average of 80% people shot are just innocent bystanders.

So if the system works, the real problem is cutting down on how guns are acquired illegally.

[Chris_F]

I'm leaning towards ozzys opinion on this one. In Canada you have to go through a four day course with the government to get a license to purchase and own a gun. They do a background check and ask one of your parents if they think if your responsible enough (regardless of age).

On top of that, if a gun club does not think you are responsible enough to handle a firearm, they will ban you.

I also think anybody criminal related history, should not be able to own a gun.

I also agree with Iroquois on gun related crimes in the city. There are some stupid people out there that would show off a loaded gun to their friends. Then some gangs would fire "x" amount of rounds in a neighborhood or night club trying to kill an intended victim. Then end up taking down more than they expected. Somebody told me that in Toronto, an average of 80% people shot are just innocent bystanders.

So if the system works, the real problem is cutting down on how guns are acquired illegally.

How is it possible that people in Toronto are shot when all the people with guns go through 4 days of training, are certified to be responsible, are not criminals, etc?

Like I said, by definition a law can not stop a crime (it just makes more crime by widening the definition of illegal behavior).

Nobody has yet to explain to me how me and my gun ownership and use has negatively impacted them or someone else.  I will not find the anti-gun argument compelling until someone explains how my actions specifically harm or endanger others.  Until then I should be allowed to own and use guns however I wish.

[ozzy72]

Nobody is saying responsible ownership is the problem Chris, speaking as a responsible owner myself I take great pleasure in shooting (although occassionally I do get the urge to sort out 12F without something more severe than grammar tests ).
This thread seems to have devolved into a discussion about illegal gun ownership, and especially the criminal fraternity.
The only way to keep them in line is harsher punishment. Alas Britain seems to be rather soft on hardened criminals

[Blackhart]

Nobody is saying responsible ownership is the problem Chris,

Yes, some here are saying preciseley that Ozzie.

It is all about some trying to impose their will on others by taking their guns and rights away. If it were not for guns, it would be something else. Merely for the joy of domination.

And about me having a gun to stop that when they come to enforce it.

Lemme see - a couple million US military, or at best another country could get a half million over here. In either case, military coup, or invasion.

A hundred million or so private gun owners.

You think Sadr City is ugly? They are 2- 5000 only.

Send some troops over here and see what happens.

THAT is why we have a right to bear arms in the Constitution.

The private gun owners are simply another tier of reserves.

And anyone that thinks that is out of date sure doesn't pay attention to current events or understand them if they do.

[Hagar]

As I mentioned earlier this discussion is quite pointless. Everyone is repeating the same old arguments I've seen many times before. You could carry on repeating them until the proverbial cows come home & nobody's opinion would be affected in the slightest. I don't see the gun laws ever being changed in the US. It's too deeply ingrained in your culture.

This subject is similar to religion & politics in that people tend to have strong feelings about it. Although I find this gun culture difficult to understand myself I have no right to criticise your beliefs & expect the same consideration towards mine.

PS. If everyone could carry on a civilised discussion as in this thread maybe there would be no need for guns at all. Wouldn't that be wonderful? Of course, it will never happen.

[Woodlouse2002]

I still think that all civilians should be allowed to have is Muskets. Thats what the constitution means. So if you rigidly want to stick to it then you must stick to what they had in mind when writing it.

And what happens when someone breaks into your home and shoots you in the head for trying to stop them if you don't have one?

If someone breaks into your house they are far more likely to shoot you if your pointing a gun at them.

[ozzy72]

I think we should all go back to using longbows and wearing tights... kinky

[RichieB16]

If someone breaks into your house they are far more likely to shoot you if your pointing a gun at them.

I don't neccessarily agree with that, if someone breaks into your house and you realize it-you have the element of suprise.  If you say something like "stop or I'll shoot" maybe they'll shoot first, but if you stand in the shadows and fire they will never even see it coming.  Now, I don't know what the laws are like elsewhere-but here we can do this.  If someone breaks into your home in Oregon, you can shoot to kill without warning.

[Fozzer]

[quote]
.....Now, I don't know what the laws are like elsewhere-but here we can do this.

[Fly2e]

I have a water gun that is very cool and it is made of a nice orange plastic. It only takes me 1 minute to fill it up and when I shoot all the water out of it, I re-fill it again. It is so much fun.  :P

Dave  ;D

[RichieB16]

...sounds like an excuse for eliminating someone you don't like...
...and getting away with it...!

I don't know the specfics of it, but I'm sure there is a lot of investigation involved and certain things would need to be confirmed (such as a forced entry).  You have to remember that there are a lot of "red neck" people out here (a lot in my family actually) and thats just the way they are.  I suppose you need to be careful who's house you break into.

[Hagar]

If someone breaks into your home in Oregon, you can shoot to kill without warning.

Hmmm. I find this a tad worrying.

if someone breaks into your house and you realize it-you have the element of suprise.

You chaps seem obsessed with the idea of people breaking into your homes.

Something that's always puzzled me. Unless you constantly walk around the house with a loaded gun or sleep with it under your pillow* it seems more than likely to me that you would be shot before you could even find it.

*PS. I'm sure that if I slept with a loaded gun under my pillow I would be in severe danger of shooting myself.