The right to die

[Scottler]

Okay, one at a time.  lol

and I flat out refuse to drive there for any reason.

Choices.

TB, that's a choice you've made.  Why should the rest of society pay for your choice?  You have an option, you've just chosen not to utilize it.

JJ, I have no problems whatsoever sending tax money to someone who is physically or mentally unable to work.  That's not an issue.  Where I have an issue is sending tax money to someone who DOESN'T work.  If I need more money, I have to make sacrifices of one sort or another.  I either have to sacrifice some of the luxuries I afford myself, or I have to sacrifice some free time and head to McDonald's for a part time job.

There are options out there.  To sit back and expect a societal handback is not only a choice, but a subsidized choice that affects us all.

[Hagar]

Very interesting. I detect a general opposition to the idea of a social medical system in the US & don't see it ever being introduced there.

In fact it works very well if you can overcome perfectly natural prejudice against it. When it was first introduced in the UK in 1948 the idea behind the NHS was quite straightforward. Everyone that can afford it pays a certain amount out of their wages towards it. This could be seen as a tax & is normally deducted from your wages & paid by your employer so you would never see it. The employer also pays a contribution for every employee. In fact this is no different to you or your employer paying into a private health scheme with one important difference. You are contributing towards the cost of medical care for every single person in the country whether they contribute towards it themselves or not. In theory the same treatment is available to everyone when they most need it.

This is the only way the system can work & until recently when they changed it for various reasons it worked very well. Yes, it's open to abuse like any other social benefit. I can understand the objections from some some quarters but having grown up with the NHS & not knowing any different, I never had any problems with it. It has its faults but I would never want to go back to how it was before 1948 when whatever treatment you got depended on your ability to pay for it.

[Scottler]

Hagar, you mentioned that you pay into it if you can afford it.  Is it an optional system in the UK?

The way it has always been presented here in the US is that it's mandatory.  You pay into it whether or not you want it.  That's where I have a problem with it.

If it were established that those who use it pay, and those who don't do not, then I would almost be willing to support it.  Granted, there would have to be quite a few concessions in order to win me over, but it's a start.

Also keep in mind that there's a HUGE population variance between the UK or Canada and the USA.  In order to pay for health care for 300,000,000 people, you'd have to charge a FORTUNE.  Overall, I believe that socialized anything is a bad idea.  Give people freedom to choose their own destiny, and you've given them everything they'll ever need.

[TacitBlue]

[quote]TB, that's a choice you've made.

[Hagar]

[quote]Hagar, you mentioned that you pay into it if you can afford it.

[Scottler]

TB, I DO get your point, but you were using that argument to justify socialized medicine.  Why should my money pay for your unwillingness to go somewhere?

[TacitBlue]

Its my money too. Wouldnt you go somewhere closer if you could? As I said its more of an issue with my employer than it is about socialized medicine. Plus Im certain that Im not the only person with this problem.

[Scottler]

Sure, I'd go closer if I could.

[Hagar]

[quote]The more fortunate support the weak.

[Scottler]

If I had a heart attack right now I would be taken to hospital & given whatever treatment I needed without anyone asking for insurance cards or if I could afford to pay for it.

Ironically, the same thing would happen here.

[TacitBlue]

fair enough.

[Scottler]

TB, in that case, if that's your concern, I'd suggest shopping around and looking for Critical Care and Long Term Care insurance.

[TacitBlue]

Youl notice I retracted my statement. You make a valid point. I dont totally agree with you, but Im done debating. you wont change my mind, and I wont change yours.

[Scottler]

lol no, but I do love debating it with you guys!  

[Hagar]

[quote]Ironically, the same thing would happen here.