Ethical Poll

[Hagar]

Soon we will need a "caution" sign on everything.:-/

Taken to its logical conclusion they will need warning signs on the warning signs.

DON'T STAND UNDER THIS SIGN OR IT MIGHT FALL ON YOUR HEAD AND KILL YOU........!

Sorry if this appears flippant but this whole compensation culture thing is beyond a joke. I can't comment on this specific case as I don't know the full details & Eno might well have a point. If they had accidently tripped or fallen against the window I might agree but deliberately leaning against a 3rd floor window still seems a tad stupid to me.

[Scottler]

Well according to the local news reports, there was a radiator in front of the window, and they were leaning OVER the radiator, with one or both hands against the glass....crazy.

[eno]

Well according to the local news reports, there was a radiator in front of the window, and they were leaning OVER the radiator, with one or both hands against the glass....crazy.

Don't tell me you have never done that sort of thing to see someone or something outside. I get the feeling that this was a badly maintained window from what you have just said Hype.

[Hagar]

Don't tell me you have never done that sort of thing to see someone or something outside. I get the feeling that this was a badly maintained window from what you have just said Hype.

I can honestly say that I've never done such a thing Eno. I was taught not to do things like that from a very young age & taught my daughter the same. This was very important in her case as we had fully glazed front & back doors. Whether the window was badly maintained or not, the glass could have broken & cut them in half as they fell through it. It doesn't bear thinking about.

[eno]

I can honestly say that I've never done such a thing Eno. I was taught not to do things like that from a very young age & taught my daughter the same. This was very important in her case as we had fully glazed front & back doors. Whether the window was badly maintained or not, the glass could have broken & cut them in half as they fell through it. It doesn't bear thinking about.

Even so ........ In doing a risk acessment for the room ....leaning on the window should be taken into consideration. Someone hadn't done their job properly. Over here in the UK the Health and Safety  would have had you dragged across the coals ...... and probably a lawsuit to boot.

[Hagar]

I know all about the Health & Safety Act as for the last few years before retiring I was responsible for health & safety in the complete facility where I worked. This included offices, a workshop full of potentially dangerous machinery & several warehouses. If we hadn't complied with the regulations they would have shut the whole place down & everyone would have been out of work until it was fixed. It's difficult enough to comply with the regulations without having to cater for the ingenious ways that people can dream up to injure themselves or others. This is almost impossible. A little common-sense should tell anyone that it's not sensible to lean against anything made of glass, especially if its part of the structure of a room above ground level.

[Scottler]

Eno, Eno, Eno...what am I going to do with you?  Whether or not the window was poorly maintained shouldn't have anything to do with it?  If you're not leaning on the window, it can be held in place with a bandaid, and you're not going to fall out.

And no, I can also honestly say I've never leaned against a window.  Maybe it's me, but I had a feeling that if it broke or fell out, there might not be anything there to keep me inside.

[eno]

I know all about the Health & Safety Act as for the last few years before retiring I was reponsible for health & safety in the complete facility where I worked. If we hadn't complied with the regulations they would have shut the whole place down & everyone would have been out of work until it was fixed. It's difficult enough to comply with the regulations without having to cater for the ingenious ways that people can dream up to injure themselves or others. This is almost impossible. A little common-sense should tell anyone that it's not sensible to lean against anything made of glass, especially if its part of the structure on a room above ground level.

I totally agree ......... but it doesn't detract from the fact that from thevery small amount of information we have ...  it looks like the window was faulty. Either the glass wasn't of the proper specification, cracked or not secured in the frame properly.

[eno]

Eno, Eno, Eno...what am I going to do with you?  Whether or not the window was poorly maintained shouldn't have anything to do with it?  If you're not leaning on the window, it can be held in place with a bandaid, and you're not going to fall out.

And no, I can also honestly say I've never leaned against a window.  Maybe it's me, but I had a feeling that if it broke or fell out, there might not be anything there to keep me inside.

Hype Hype Hype ......... you should always plan for the worst case ..... and it was a window that could be leaned on. You may not lean on windows, but other people do. So  if they are able to be leaned on ........ make sure they are secure. Yes the girls were silly to lean on the glass but they had every reason to think that it would be secure. However the glass should have been of a type that shouldn't break and secured properly in the frame. Now without the full facts I don't think anyone is in the proper position to judge who was to blame.
I'm going to err on the side of poor maintainence.

[Hagar]

I don't know enough about this particular case to comment. I'm sure there will be an official investigation as the room was apparently used for commercial purposes involving members of the public. Assuming you're correct & the window is found to have been faulty or not fitted with adequate safety rails the blame would have been apportioned. That was before this compensation culture which complicated things. It's no longer a matter of safety but what people can get out of it & I'm not sure what happens now. I still say it was stupid to lean against a window whether it was faulty or not so these women should take their share of the blame.

[eno]

They won't do it again in a hurry  ;D

[Scottler]

Oh, don't get me wrong.  If it's proven that the window was in any way faulty, then I can see giving the two women coverage of their medical expenses.

But I can easily see this becoming an "I am mentally anguished" kinda case and it involving the use of a dollar sign, a comma and several zeroes.  That's where I have a problem.

[eno]

Oh, don't get me wrong.  If it's proven that the window was in any way faulty, then I can see giving the two women coverage of their medical expenses.

But I can easily see this becoming an "I am mentally anguished" kinda case and it involving the use of a dollar sign, a comma and several zeroes.  That's where I have a problem.

I can see that too, however  that's the fault of Lawyers on the most part......... but having done hundreds of risk assessments <--(My wife the speel cheeker reminded me ) on different types of buildings for the purposes of using them as temporary theatres, you take as many stupid acts into account and then some more.

[Hagar]

The problem as I see it is catering for every possible thing that can go wrong. The most sensible thing would be to employ a Company Idiot whose duty it is to see if he/she can possibly dream up a way of injuring him/herself or anyone else so the company can take preventative action. I can only say I'm glad I retired when I did & I pity my replacement. The sooner the legislation my old mate Fireman mentioned is implemented, the better as far as I'm concerned. (I'm sure he comes across plenty of similar things in his line of work.) Of course, that's in the US. Unfortunately we imported this compensation culture which is now becoming popular on this side of the Pond & it might not be so easily dealt with here.

PS. We always seem to import the worst things from the US. Why not import a few of their better ideas instead.

[Woodlouse2002]

I'm personally with Eno on this one. In a public place windows should always be maintained in a way that will not allow people to fall out of them. Sure the girls were foolish to lean on the window but don't condemn them as complete retards intill you know even half of the facts.