Police and guns...

[C]

It just occured to me whilst watch a "Police, Camera, Action" that when in the UK car chases come to an end, the occupants get out an run, and (maybe) get caught an hour later by several knackered (unarmed) policemen.

In the US, the car stops, the occupants get out and put their hands up!

[Craig.]

What I find embarresing. You watch these police chases from the US, and its usually some honking big 3.5L V8 car. Then you see ours and its some crappy little vauxhall astra.

[Sir_Crashalot]

I like the British way better, less guns, less bulletholes.

Crash

[Theis]

The danish police uses the H&K USP Compact 9mm



Great stopping power!

http://www.hecklerkoch-usa.com/index.js ... ber=704531

Cheers Theis

[ozzy72]

My cousin is in SO19s notorious Black Team! He likes my policy of "Court cases cost millions a 9mm bullet costs pennies! Save the taxpayer"

[Ivan]

Sometimes you want that the police uses heavier guns... Like in Antwerp where they had to shoot a guy that already tried to kill 3 people with a sawn-off.

In other case you absolutely DON'T want police to have guns at all (like in holland where they can't shoot)

[Brett_Henderson]

The danish police uses the H&K USP Compact 9mm

Great stopping power!

Point of ballistic realities. The H&K USP is a fine firearm, but the 9mm cartrige is a poor stopper. There are fewer and fewer  U.S. agancies still using it. It's nothing more than a .38 special; both in bullet weight/diameter and velocity.

There's an elusive formula for weight/diameter/velocity that equates to stopping power. (not killing power, but where the victim "stops" being a threat)..

Years ago, Evan Marshall set out digging through YEARS of shooting data in order to document the best, "One shot stop" bullet. What he came up with was:

125grain .357Magnum @ 1400fps

Because of the 9mm craze of the 80's (something like 80% of departments tried the 9mm) ...  the data was skewed, slightly improving the 9mm reputation, but when the dust settled, the .357Magnum was still way ahead (something like 97% one-shot stops).

Unfortunately, that round is a revolver only. There are some hybrid caliber semi-autos out there, like the 357Sig, but they're hardly mainstream and police departments shy away from them.

.44Magnum and 10mm are more powerful on paper, but that power never translated into stopping power in the real world. Mostly due to over-penetration (wasted energey not  used up in the target).

.40S&W and .45ACP are the best bets in semi-auto pistols, though the .45ACP isn't much better than the 9mm for stopping power.

[Theis]

i should've said compared to the 7.62mm Walter pistols the danish police had before



With the Walter-pistol did the police experience, that the stop effect wasn't great enough.
When the police shoots, is it to stop a criminal, that is vital to stop. thats why it's a problem when a single shot isn't enough

"Previously could the police experience, that the criminals attacked again and again - even after several shots from the police. Thats why the Walter-pistols less effect could provide, that the police was forced to shoot for seriusly harm, or even to kill - in situations where a more effective first shot could had stopped the crime far earlier and may with less damage to follow" - Explains Peter Heide, who is Politihistorisk Museums (Police history museum) expert in the danish police's weapons

Cheers Theis

[Loafing Smurf]

Over the past few weeks I've been getting progressively becoming more knowledgeable about firearms. And I know for a fact that police use the Glaser Safety Slug in their handguns.

The Glaser Safety Slug is designed to increase stopping power and reduce penetration. This is done by placing a plastic tip at the end of the slug. Upon impact the slug expands and burst, depending on the harness of the object. This reduces penetration into flesh and lowers possible damage to property.

This design seems like a good idea if the police is to use firearms in law enforcement. It increases the odds that the police would apprehend the criminal rather than kill them.

1) Platic Tip
2) Metal Jacket
3) Lead Shots

[Saitek]

Guns? Ban them. Funny what Craig said though - I agree. Our silly little Astras. lol

[beefhole]

This design seems like a good idea if the police is to use firearms in law enforcement. It increases the odds that the police would apprehend the criminal rather than kill them.

Interesting considering, from what I know, the majority of police have policies that lethal weapons are only to be used on people when you intend to kill them.

[Loafing Smurf]

In other words, I'm saying that the Glaser Saftey Slug does a better job at apprehending a suspect compared to a full metal jacket slug.

[beefhole]

In other words, I'm saying that the Glaser Saftey Slug does a better job at apprehending a suspect compared to a full metal jacket slug.

I can't imagine why normal cops would use FMJ rounds-maybe tac teams that are specifically going up gainst suspects with body armor, but FMJ is dangerous to use in a crowded area against unarmored suspects (you probably know that).  

What about JHP?  I'm not real knowledgable on ammo, but I thought JHP is the type generally carried for use against unarmored foes.

[Brett_Henderson]

The Glaser Saftey Slug has been around for a while. It never did catch on with a majority of police departments (here in the U.S. anyway). It's not very accurate and it's real claim to fame isn't stopping power, but "safety".. As there's little chance of it passing through a target and hitting an unintended target. It's a decent round for home defense, but not for police use.

Edit: Beefhole is correct.. Hollow-points are the round of choice for police departments.. Specifically the Winchester Silvertip. It's far and away the most popular choice for law-enforcement.

[Scorpiоn]

It just occured to me whilst watch a "Police, Camera, Action" that when in the UK car chases come to an end, the occupants get out an run, and (maybe) get caught an hour later by several knackered (unarmed) policemen.

In the US, the car stops, the occupants get out and put their hands up!

Police?  Guns?  I don't even trust the cops with themselves!