Castles

[Flying Trucker]

Good morning all...

Several things we do not see much of here in the colony are castles and palaces.  
Oh yes we have a castle in Toronto Ontario but not to the scale I think that was built in the old world.

Are castles and palaces the same thing or what is older, a castle or a palace.

Who designed and built the most elaborate castles, were any castles built with access to open water, docks etc. or with a runway or helicopter pad.

Does any military still maintain a castle today, I am sure there must have been a few during the two Great Wars or even the Cold War.

Is a castle only built of stone, I am sure one could be built of wood or poured concrete but would that make it a castle?

Just curious I am not looking for something with a dungeon or keep to lock the Nattering Nannies in.  

I have always been intrigued and fascinated by castles, palaces, forts and large old ships.  :)  

Cheers...Happy Landings...Doug

[Hagar]

Hi Doug. I'm no expert on the subject but a castle is usually a heavily fortified defensive structure built in a strategic location in case of attack. Most castles in my part of the world were built in the Middle Ages & very few survive intact. Many were deliberately destroyed by Oliver Cromwell's forces during the Civil War. One exception is Arundel Castle about 10 miles from here which is not only a popular tourist attraction but also the official home of the Dukes of Norfolk. (Don't ask why the Dukes of Norfolk reside in Sussex.) I'm sure you've seen the photos I've posted of it.

A palace is a royal residence of some sort but not usually fortified. The British Parliament sits in the ancient Palace of Westminster which was originally a royal palace. Very little of the original structure survives today. There are still several castles & palaces maintained for the use of the British Royal Family including Buckingham Palace & Windsor Castle.

[Flying Trucker]

Hi Doug

I was wondering if castles were originally a  British designed structure that made their way to the rest of Europe.

I never hear of forts on the British Isle, I wonder if that was more of a colonial structure as there are a lot in the United States and Canada.

Here in Canada most military installations are called "Bases", however prior to that I believe the army called them "Camps" and I would assume, I am only guessing but prior to "Camps" they were "Forts".

I am talking only Army hear not Navy or Air Force.

I wonder if the terminology or nomenclature for the army went something like this:
(1) Castle
(2) Fort
(3) Camp
(4) Base

Just curious.  

Cheers...Happy Landings...Doug

[Hagar]

I was wondering if castles were originally a  British designed structure that made their way to the rest of Europe.

I think it's the other way round. The traditional castle was introduced to England from mainland Europe, mainly by William the Conqueror after the invasion of 1066.

I never hear of forts on the British Isle, I wonder if that was more of a colonial structure as there are a lot in the United States and Canada.

The question is, when does a fort become a castle? There are forts in England but I think of them as temporary structures, mainly of wooden construction. The original ancient castles would also have been built of wood but these would not survive today for obvious reasons.  I think of a fort as a purely military defensive structure whereas a castle is also used as a private residence (or seat) for the local ruler & his family who would usually be members of the aristocracy.

[C]

I think they probably developed from hill forts in a few thousand BC. As always I thing the Romans had a lot to do with making them effective and adding a certain amount of fortification.

In the UK the earliest "castles" (as we know them) date from Norman times I suspect - such as Rochester castle in Kent. Certainly by the 1700-1800s they were back out of favour, replaced by coastal forts.

[Hagar]

All you wanted to know about forts & castles in England & Wales. http://www.ecastles.co.uk/history.html

[Fozzer]

I think they probably developed from hill forts in a few thousand BC. As always I thing the Romans had a lot to do with making them effective and adding a certain amount of fortification.

In the UK the earliest "castles" (as we know them) date from Norman times I suspect - such as Rochester castle in Kent. Certainly by the 1700-1800s they were back out of favour, replaced by coastal forts.

Hill Forts.

My Family name "Fosbery" originates from Iron Age Times.
Bery/Bury = An Iron Age Hill fortress.
Fos = the Tribe who lived in the Fortress.

http://fosbery.tripod.com/

The Fortress was a natural earth mound, enveloped by a trench or wooden palisade for defence against invaders.

My Town of Hereford used to have a Motte-and Bailey Timber Castle, pre-1052, which no longer exists...obviously... ...!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hereford_Castle

Europe is well blessed with extremely old Castles and defences dating from ancient times!

Paul L. Fosbery...A very Ancient Briton... ...!

[TacitBlue]

Some Army bases in the US are still called forts, even though there usually isn't an actual fort there. Fort Leonard Wood in Missouri for example.

[beaky]

Sometimes a chair stood on a bed with a blanket over it is considered a fort...then there's tree forts, snow forts... "fort" was the word, when I was a kid, for any place where one would make a valiant stand against the terrible onslaught of demanding grownups and nosy, icky girls.

But "fort" is most likely short for "fortification" (from the French, I guess)... so it could be made of anything, really.

[TSC.]

My Favourite fort: [url=http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/07_02/nomansfortDM1501_468x332.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html%3Fin_article_id%3D468609%26in_page_id%3D1770&h=332&w=468&sz=67&hl=en&start=3&um=1&tbnid=g1R6aUYAlxopJM:&tbnh=91&tbnw=128&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dno%2Bmans%2Bland%2Bfort%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff]Man-made island fit for a Bond villain up for sale - for

[Fozzer]

[quote]My Favourite fort: [url=http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/07_02/nomansfortDM1501_468x332.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html%3Fin_article_id%3D468609%26in_page_id%3D1770&h=332&w=468&sz=67&hl=en&start=3&um=1&tbnid=g1R6aUYAlxopJM:&tbnh=91&tbnw=128&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dno%2Bmans%2Bland%2Bfort%26um%3D1%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff]Man-made island fit for a Bond villain up for sale - for

[Ivan]

I think they probably developed from hill forts in a few thousand BC. As always I thing the Romans had a lot to do with making them effective and adding a certain amount of fortification.

In the UK the earliest "castles" (as we know them) date from Norman times I suspect - such as Rochester castle in Kent. Certainly by the 1700-1800s they were back out of favour, replaced by coastal forts.

Castle comes from the roman Castellum... translation of that is both fortress and castle depending on the situation, but usually its the larger permanent ones.
Castra is the other type of roman fortification. depending on context this can be either a temporary camp or a small fortification. The main difference between a castellum and a castra is the layout. A castra always has the same layout, while a castellum could be either new-build (with castra layout) or inherited from the previous owners.

Romans absolutely hated neolithic hill fortresses, for the simple fact that those were the only defensible spots in the landscape. Their usual siege tools were tuned to mediterranean style defensive positions, not to huge earth walls. And as most of those hill fortresses had natural water supplies, just surrounding the thing didn't work that well either

Often Norman castles are improved roman camps. The locations that the romans had chosen for their defensive positions when they made a permanent camp were just as useful in the middle ages, as the weapons didnt change that much.

[quote]I was wondering if castles were originally a

[Flying Trucker]

Good morning all...

Interesting and fascinating information...thanks one and all...

Cheers...Happy Landings...Doug

[Chris_F]

(1) Castle
(2) Fort
(3) Camp
(4) Base

I've been to one castle, one palace, a handful of forts, a bunch of camps, and a handful of bases.  My non-scientific analysis is this:

Castle: a medieval defensive structure typically made out of stone and intended to control critical strategic points.

Castles were made largely obsolete by the invetion of gunpowder and the various mortars, cannon, etc that came along with it.

Fort: A typically earthen or earth/wooden structure generally used during the 18th and 19th century.

Lots of forts in the USA, relics of the Ameican revolution and Civil Wars.  Forts are typically situated to give cannons within them control over a strategic geographic feature, like a harbor inlet.  They provide protection for the guys working the cannons.

Modern weapons, particularly aircraft and missiles, make these largely or entirely obsolete.

Base:  A built up area used for military purposes.  Essentially a small town for military folks, and the various tasks associated with running a fighting force.  Bases have office buildings, training and logistics facilities, etc.  No real physical defensive measures like you'd find with a fort or castle.

Camp:  A patch of land soldiers pitch tents on.  A make-shift base.

Now, modern military facilities may be named for structures which WERE there but aren't anymore (or are only historical artifacts).  Modern military forts and camps probably fall under this.

[Fozzer]

Europe is the place to visit, for amazing Castles...

..I love 'em!... ...!

Paul...Opening a bottle of Fortified Wine at the moment!... [smiley=beer.gif]...Hic!...!