Interesting attempt

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Re: Interesting attempt

Postby Hagar » Wed Jul 14, 2004 4:32 am

Going back to the comment regarding his "SOFTWARE"......

I hope it's a bit more stable than than the MS FS stuff we have come to love and admire......

Next thing we know he'll "pop-up" on the forums seeking advice .................

;D LOL Bazza ;D

My thoughts exactly. This applies to all software used on aircraft - especially these fly-by-wire systems that seem so popular nowadays. I'm told that some modern aircraft now in service cannot fly unless they're controlled by a computer. Let's hope they don't rely on Windows. LOL ;)
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Re: Interesting attempt

Postby DougC-3 » Wed Jul 14, 2004 7:21 am

How many of you know that General James H. Doolittle... made the first "blind" flight from take off to landing.

The similarity to Doolittle's flight, which I learned of just a year or so ago ;), was about the first thing that came to my mind, and...

Hagar also said,
The only problem I can see is keeping a lookout for other aircraft which is more important now than it ever was.

Theoretically, I suppose this could be handled by radar... but, again on the cynical side, the radar could (theoretically) input to the autopilot computer.  This sort of thing would ultimately arrive at a robot plane with the pilot completely out of the loop...  I want to say that some UAV drones may already have the ability to fly around without human input, but I guess I've been reading too much sci-fi ;).

In any case this kind of thing must give a blind person an exhilarating feeling of freedom and, more importantly, make other blind people realize that some of their limitations may be self imposed :).
Comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable.
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Re: Interesting attempt

Postby Hagar » Wed Jul 14, 2004 7:49 am

The similarity to Doolittle's flight, which I learned of just a year or so ago ;), was about the first thing that came to my mind,

"Jimmy" Doolittle has been a hero of mine since I first read his autobiography many years ago. His incredible achievements deserve at least a thread to themselves & this wouldn't do him justice. A great man & pioneer aviator. Aviation owes this man a lot.

PS. If I remember correctly, Doolittle objected to carrying a safety pilot on that first "blind" flight. His employers insisted on it.
Last edited by Hagar on Wed Jul 14, 2004 7:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Scorpiоn » Wed Jul 14, 2004 2:52 pm

I dunno.  I'm still rather unenthused about the whole thing.

Dolittle's flight was impressive because he he did the whole thing by his instruments and with his head.  Real pilots fly that way (and of course, with an unobstructed canopy), not with GPS, ILS and all that other mish-mash.

As far as other blind people, this is where I choose not to be open minded.  Let's all inspie to pursue they're dream to fly and you'll have Cessnas all over the sky inverted and with the constant heading of a butterfly. :P
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Re: Interesting attempt

Postby Bazza » Thu Jul 15, 2004 2:55 am

Let's face it, the guy is obviously one of those types who "won't lie down" and good luck to him.

Over the years I've read a bit about "spatial disorientation" and we all know how long we last even in a simulation environment without horizons or instruments.     If you've never tried it, switch on to your favourite plane, select a black night without stars, no instruments and see if you can last one minute.

Clearly for this flight  the blind guy will depend solely on his observer keeping him straight, level and legal.     On a TV news segment I saw, the observer was nudging the yoke with his spare hand, obviously making small adjustments.

Interesting though.....no doubt he'll be making a documentary on it - no doubt Discovery Channel, thrill seekers etc....
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Re: Interesting attempt

Postby Staiduk » Sun Jul 18, 2004 8:10 am

...This was done under a hood in a Consolidated NY-2 biplane. He naturally carried a safety pilot in case anything went wrong with the instruments. I don't really see the difference. http://www.firstflight.org/shrine/jimmy_doolittle.cfm


Hmm - it's exceedingly rare I disagree with Hagar; but this time...
First; all power to the guy. What he's doing is about as far from smart as you can get; but we Humans have never placed a whole lot of reliance on doing the smart thing - most of our achievement came from throwing ourselves into the abyss and figuring out how to survive once the bottom came into view.
But as for comparing his flight to Dolittle's; I can see a world of difference. Dolittle couldn't see outside; but he could see his instruments. Mr. Cunningham doesn't have that option. OK; it appears he has something that gives him audio updates; that's a world of difference from the immediate, intuitive picture you get from the six-pack. I mean; by the time the computer finishes telling you "Altitude 5000, A/S 160, bank 15deg. right, ball centered" etc; the aircraft's attitude could have changed radically. Even accounting for a high-speed shorthand they must be using; all of us who fly know just how fast things can change even in clear air. I ignore the question I first asked myself: "how would the computer deal with a P/S (or any instrument) failure?" as being unnecessarily complicating.
Hey; don't get me wrong - the guy's got cojones and that's something sorely lacking nowadays methinks. I personally wouldn't mind riding in the right-hand seat with him - it'd be an adventure! But if it leads to advances that allow people with visual conditions - not necessarily blindness - to fly or operate other vehicles; I say no way - freedom is great; but not at the expense of general safety. :)
Cheers!

Oh, P.S.: Bazza wrote:
Over the years I've read a bit about "spatial disorientation" and we all know how long we last even in a simulation environment without horizons or instruments.     If you've never tried it, switch on to your favourite plane, select a black night without stars, no instruments and see if you can last one minute.


You know; I simply don't understand that. I don't have my instrument rating yet; won't be going for it for a couple years yet (time and money. ::) ) but I've got no problems at all using instruments in routine flight. Either in FS9; or in the simulator at the airport; or in real aircraft with an instrument-rated pilot beside me. No particular abilities; it just seemed to me right from my first flight in the left-hand seat at age 16 that the instruments were there for a reason - so learn how to use 'em. It totally mystifies me that most of the newly-hatched PPL's I know can't keep a level, co-ordinated turn while flying blind.
OK; I know how little you actually learn in 45 hours, but really - to my way of thinking; if you can't hold a level turn - the absolutely easiest thing to do in a C-172 - what else can't you do - like perform emergency procedures?
Sorry - preaching again. I get into rows all the time with my former instructors about this - they say 'learn to fly the airplane first; then get into the more difficult bits later'. I say "Understand flight and your aircraft before learning to fly - you'll understand more of what you're learning'. The argument has been acrimonious at times; to the point where I bet one of my instructors $100 (back when I was a student) I could fly the simulator from London (ont.) to Kitchener via instruments with the video off. Given the respect I tend to show instructors (the same kind I like from my students); that's a serious break in courtesy from me.
Guy never paid up though; so I don't feel too bad. ;)

Cheers again!
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Re: Interesting attempt

Postby Hagar » Sun Jul 18, 2004 9:46 am

Hmm - it's exceedingly rare I disagree with Hagar; but this time...

On the whole I have to agree with the rest of you. I sometimes enjoy provoking discussion by playing the Devil's Advocate. ;)

Dolittle couldn't see outside; but he could see his instruments. Mr. Cunningham doesn't have that option. OK; it appears he has something that gives him audio updates; that's a world of difference from the immediate, intuitive picture you get from the six-pack. I mean; by the time the computer finishes telling you "Altitude 5000, A/S 160, bank 15deg. right, ball centered"

However, I can see a time when this technology, or an improved version of it, could be implanted into a blind person's optic nerve, rather like Geordie's visor in Star Trek. Great achievements often stem from small beginnings. ;)
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Re: Interesting attempt

Postby Staiduk » Sun Jul 18, 2004 10:05 pm


However, I can see a time when this technology, or an improved version of it, could be implanted into a blind person's optic nerve, rather like Geordie's visor in Star Trek. Great achievements often stem from small beginnings. ;)


...and in that; we're in total agreement. :)
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