Pattern Entry

[Capt.Propwash]

I have heard many times from FS ATC to "...Enter Right / Left downwind".

ok. I know Upwind, Crosswind, Downwind, Base > Final.  I get that it is an oval shape next to the airport.   


on a HDG 275, landing @ KCHS Rwy 33, ...... "N176CM, Enter Right Downwind"



do I turn BEFORE i get to the airport and make a right handed loop so the airport is to PORT, and come back around for the runway, and get lined up on HDG 330??? or do i turn right go completely around the airport and come back for 330?


(i guess i need to break out my "old" sectionals that i got from a USAIR pilot and study up some more). hmmmm

[DaveSims]

Right means all turns are made to the right, left means all turns are to the left.  Remember the traffic pattern is shaped like a racetrack, with the downwind parallel to the runway, heading in the opposite direction you will be landing.  So a left downwind would mean the runway will be on your left side (so you have to turn left).

[olderndirt]

The pattern is more of a rectangle than an oval - no wind turns 90

[Capt.Propwash]

usually by the time that i would get to the point of just starting the 'downwind' (flying away from the airport on a HDG of 150) ATC clears me to land, then I have to pull a 180 and go BACK to 330 for the landing.   I hate that.

[DaveSims]

[quote]usually by the time that i would get to the point of just starting the 'downwind' (flying away from the airport on a HDG of 150) ATC clears me to land, then I have to pull a 180 and go BACK to 330 for the landing.

[Capt.Propwash]

I know Upwind, Crosswind, Downwind, Base > Final.  I get that it is an oval shape next to the airport

I just cant/couldnt figure out 'exactly' why ATC would tell me "make right downwind" if i am coming FROM starboard side of my expected runway.   That means I have to enter a pattern that would consist of,  Make a 450 degree turn to the RIGHT [360+90] (now) and land.    :-? :-?

Why can i not just turn RIGHT BASE/Final and land?

[beaky]

[quote][quote]I know Upwind, Crosswind, Downwind, Base > Final.

[Brett_Henderson]

(the problem with the pattern you show is that the runway should be in the middle, between the upwind and downwind legs):

The upwind leg is right over the runway, isn't it ?  :-?

[beaky]

(the problem with the pattern you show is that the runway should be in the middle, between the upwind and downwind legs):

The upwind leg is right over the runway, isn't it ?

[Brett_Henderson]

Yeah.. that 'displaced' diagram is wrong..

I could be mistaken.. but I always thought an upwind entry entailed flying right over the runway... where spacing is the same for any other leg. It's obviously not something that would happen often, as it would be messy at a crowded pattern, and not needed if you fly straight in.

Flying an upwind, which is essentially a reciprocal downwind, would at best put you into the helicopter's pattern, at worst be prohibited airspace (as in a right pattern normally means they don't want you on the other side).

I'm honestly not sure.. and there aren't any hard rules, either. If I were in a position to enter what would be the upwind you describe .. for a 09/27

[olderndirt]

Here's a little diagram from Wiki - left traffic but right traffic is just across the runway

[ViperPilot]

Hello!

Great topic... learning traffic patterns took a while, but it was well worth it!

I have a question, though. Usually when I take off for some pattern work, I try to set up so that I'm at TPA by the time I'm starting the turn into the downwind leg from crosswind. Is this correct, or should I be aiming for TPA earlier in the pattern?

Thanks for all of the replies,

Alan

[Brett_Henderson]

Hello!

Great topic... learning traffic patterns took a while, but it was well worth it!

I have a question, though. Usually when I take off for some pattern work, I try to set up so that I'm at TPA by the time I'm starting the turn into the downwind leg from crosswind. Is this correct, or should I be aiming for TPA earlier in the pattern?

Thanks for all of the replies,

Alan

Normally.. you just end up at TPA where a Vy climb decides .. with a good headwind, on a winter day.. that might very well be before you turn crosswind  .. or at a long runway, you can still be OVER the runway at TPA

[ViperPilot]

Hello!

Brett: Thanks! I wasn't sure if there was a set procedure or time frame for achieving TPA. I'll continue to practice and make the transitions smoother.

Alan

[DaveSims]

I usually achieve TPA on the downwind.  I was taught to turn crosswind at 500 feet.  I think part of the thought process on that is to start the turn back towards the runway in case of engine failure.  I was also taught to fly upwinds slight offset from the runway in case there is traffic on the runway below you and climbing.