Simviation Forums

My parents will never get me a joystick or Y&P before mastering the keyboard first, my parents know I don't always get the centerline, especially true in challenging approaches like TNCM and VHHX RWY13. For my parents, it means being able to shoot a checkerboard approach (VHHX RWY13) on keyboard and touch down on the runway centerline with enough runway to get myself to 10-20 kts by hold short point of RWY31, with a 747-400 (since that's the largest thing that landed in Kai Tak).

I know these two are hard to perform even with the best joystick and the best operator. Last time I landed in Kai Tak through the checkerboard, I touched down B-KPA (a 773ER) on the runway with enough runway to stop but halfway between the centerline and the runway edge. This is proof that my mastery of the keyboard is far from anything reasonable.

How should I use the keyboard better to increase my chances to get the centerline of the runway and enough runway to get myself to 10-20 kts by hold short point of RWY31? All I used in my last try was the arrow and F1-F4 buttons.

umm... if your parents won't get you a joystick, then I'd save up for one myself. I couldn't live without mine...

How should I use the keyboard better to increase my chances to get the centerline of the runway and enough runway to get myself to 10-20 kts by hold short point of RWY31? All I used in my last try was the arrow and F1-F4 buttons.

Pawn it, and buy http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ... 6826102505 .

Or do something, anything to get a joystick, they don't fly 747's with a keyboard...

Try a second hand electronics store. I got a stick for a couple of dollars that lasted me 3 years!

Not ONLY is the stick a good thing to have, but getting a stick with throttle and flaps levers are REALLY good two. I got a Saitek Aviator for $40 at Best Buy which was a lot but was well worth it. Also, the rudder control on the stick is must easier to use on a twist stick. I was a keyboard flier for over 6 months and only mastered the ILS approach to TNCM and KLAX but landed horrible. Now I make spot-on ILS landings at KLAX, KDEN, KJFK, TNCM, VHHX and Checkerboard ILS rnwy 13 VHHX in 747's.  (I don't know if Denver flies 747's there but I do it anyways.

With all respect to your parents, that's insane... the whole point of having a joystick is that it's nearly impossible to fly with any precision at all with the keyboard alone, let alone shoot perfect Kai Tak approaches and landings!!
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Have you ever seen a real 747 landing at Kai Tak when the wind was blowing (which is most of the time)? The kind of landing you describe was a very rare thing at that airport, even with a real 747.

But let's say you manage to get to that point with the keyboard- why even bother with a joystick, then?
It doesn't make any sense, even if they're just making sure you are really dedicated before they spend any more money on your hobby.

Maybe you can make a deal with them: better grades or something like that.

Remember also that you can get a used joystick very cheap on eBay; it doesn't have to be a very good one, it will still be much better than the keyboard.

With all respect to your parents, that's insane... the whole point of having a joystick is that it's nearly impossible to fly with any precision at all with the keyboard alone, let alone shoot perfect Kai Tak approaches and landings!!
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Have you ever seen a real 747 landing at Kai Tak when the wind was blowing (which is most of the time)? The kind of landing you describe was a very rare thing at that airport, even with a real 747.

But let's say you manage to get to that point with the keyboard- why even bother with a joystick, then?
It doesn't make any sense, even if they're just making sure you are really dedicated before they spend any more money on your hobby.

Maybe you can make a deal with them: better grades or something like that.

Remember also that you can get a used joystick very cheap on eBay; it doesn't have to be a very good one, it will still be much better than the keyboard.

To shoot a RWY13 approach into VHHX and still get to the runway centerline (provided that you have enough runway to slow yourself down to a safe speed to turn on a taxiway) with a keyboard alone is the ultimate demonstration of keyboard mastery, no matter which combination of buttons you use. It's easier with a C208 but I know the real airport saw 747s land every day when it still was open. When I'll succeed that, even once, with any of the aircraft I (and they) took to or from Kai Tak as passengers (A330-300, A340-300 or 747-400), then my parents will consider that I have enough skill on the keyboard for them. Basically, they want me to become the best pilot on keyboard in the world (since there is no one, to my knowledge, that did so on a keyboard alone).

My parents want me to master the keyboard since they claim that since joysticks can fail just like any piece of equipment, you have to be ready when joystick issues come.

My parents want me to master the keyboard since they claim that since joysticks can fail just like any piece of equipment, you have to be ready when joystick issues come.

In that case tell your parents that all aircraft have redundant systems and the keyboard is a backup for when the joystick fails.

My parents want me to master the keyboard since they claim that since joysticks can fail just like any piece of equipment, you have to be ready when joystick issues come.

In that case tell your parents that all aircraft have redundant systems and the keyboard is a backup for when the joystick fails.

They obviously want me to master the backup before mastering the main system, as they will not consider getting the "main system" (the joystick) before I have gained the best out of the keyboard.

My parents want me to master the keyboard since they claim that since joysticks can fail just like any piece of equipment, you have to be ready when joystick issues come.

In that case tell your parents that all aircraft have redundant systems and the keyboard is a backup for when the joystick fails.

They obviously want me to master the backup before mastering the main system, as they will not consider getting the "main system" (the joystick) before I have gained the best out of the keyboard.

With all due respect; it's your hobby, why should your parents dictate how dedicated you have to be?

My parents want me to master the keyboard since they claim that since joysticks can fail just like any piece of equipment, you have to be ready when joystick issues come.

I'd be more interested in mastering a parachute if my joystick failed.  I've never seen any aircraft that you can fly with a keyboard.

Tell your parents that what they're asking, is like like expecting you to master Windows without a mouse, before they'll get you a mouse. Sure, you can fumble your way through with the arrow keys, tab key and the enter key but you can't get anything done, OR learn anything. Flying by keyboard is beyond pointless.

I've always flown keyboard...and almost always hit centerline...Experience I suppose :-/

try using the auto pilot more....


OR plead, beg, cry, and/or bargain your way to a joystick

try using the auto pilot more....


OR plead, beg, cry, and/or bargain your way to a joystick

The autopilot is of use after I get a positive rate of climb, I disengage it when in the ILS feather (if the RWY in use has an ILS).