Viewing the mdl

[Chan_Rak]

Greetings;

On the aircraft files that I have there is a model folder, and when I go inside I see the mdl file.  I want to open this file to see some things such as the lights and make some adjustment so it works better or eliminate the fixed light (strobes) and work it out from my Aircraft cfg.  However I need to make this adustment fix inside the mdl that was created by someone else.  So is there a program that I can use that can open this mdl file and put this same file back after the adjustment is made?????

This is all I want to do mainly to enjoy my aircraft better overall.

Chan

[Brett_Henderson]

From my limited understanding of it.. there are "decompilers" out there. The trick are many-fold though.

In order to DO anything TO that file... you have to have the proper modeling software, and know how to use it. And even after THAT.. the uncompiled model is stripped of it's unique animations and material properties... so you'd have to re-model all of that stuff.

For all intents and purposes.. there isn't much that can be done to a model, unless you have the original source code.

[garryrussell]

AS Brett says you lose the animations, mapping, etc so you may just as well start again

Also I think you will find that just about all models are released on the condition that it is not to be decompiled.

Garry

[Chan_Rak]

Oh man, are you saying that once you open the mdl file you lose all the data inside it when it is decompiled????  And again have to redo everything all over again spec wise and then compile it????

Why they can't make one simple kind like they do for the airfile and or for the CFG????

Hmmm, you did mention the conditon that such be not decompiled and I wonder why????

A model of a sim airplane should not have to be so complicated.  I can see Abacus is able to let you paint colors in a simplified manner.

I got a plane that is a good one called RFP a nice 747-200.  I have just one main grievance and it is the strobe light that seems to be hard coded into the model and it flashes at all the wrong spots and it is simutaneous with the VC light as well.  I simply wanted to eliminate that portion out of the hard code and leave the rest of the plane alone as it is fine.

From there I wanted to insert the lights in the proper places the becons, navs and strobes etc.  This can be controlled in the Aircraft CFG and or airfile of the same.

We must have some flexibility concerning models and some of the creators granted that they have spent so much time on them and even sell these models for ridiculous prices if I may be allowed to say so, has gotten literally cornered.

I understand some people when they make certain wishes concerning their creation, and rightfully so doing it payware or shareware.  But when it becomes Freeware, this means it is wide open to allow people to adjust or refine the existing plane to be better without being prejudiced or crucified.

Freeware means open to all.  Nothing short of that sentence.  Ok and this is to my understanding.  Of course we do get a pilfish here and there, but again this is going to happen.  

Now GMAX has made it so that the Microsoft Make Model SDK can go inside and not lose this data (correct me if I am wrong) and one can make adjustments if needed to further and enhance the plane and its characteristics.

Microsoft for a long time withheld many of the secrets from us until we put a lot of pressure and then they released the source codes for us to play with and to tinker with etc things even got better thru time because of a cooperative environment and better ideas.  Why cannot the MDL makers do the same??????

So this is all I wanted to do and if anyone knows the good compiler and decompiler that works for the mdl, please let me know.  I will try to work it out myself.

Chan

[Wing Nut]

There is a big difference between painting an airplane and changing the model.

[garryrussell]

Freeware means no price has been charged

It does not mean open for all

If you get a free gift from a shop that does no mean the product copyright is opened

People have been kind enough to give something without charge after hundred of hours work.

The copyright belongs to the author and if breached then that is stealing.

How do you come to the conclusion that freeware means all rights are given up???

Garry

[Hagar]

In Chan's defence all he wants to do is remove a strobe light defined in the MDL file. Surely that's no big crime. He didn't mention which version of FS he wants the aircraft for but I presume this is an older model created with FSDS for FS2002.

[quote]Keep in mind, that mdl file is instructions for placing sometimes as many as 60,000 polygons in the sim.

[Alejandro Rhodes]

Freeware means no price has been charged

It does not mean open for all

If you get a free gift from a shop that does no mean the product copyright is opened

People have been kind enough to give something without charge after hundred of hours work.

The copyright belongs to the author and if breached then that is stealing.

How do you come to the conclusion that freeware means all rights are given up???

Garry

May I use this words to use it as my avatar ?  

Well said Gary

[Brett_Henderson]

You're reading too much into this. But for the sake of technical correctness.. you're confusing freeware, with, "open source" software.. where it's exactly as it implies.. The source code is freely distrubuted, and modified.

That a model file is "encrypted", is a function of the compilation. The realtionship between an FSX model-file, and its Gmax source-file; is the same relationship between ANY programming language's source-file (that a programmer can write and edit), and its compiled, executable file. When you sit down and write some huge program, that "language" is for YOUR benefit. A computer doesn't need all those pages of read-able code and syntax.. it just needs simple, machine-language-like instructions... usually in hexadecimal format. A compiled program (or model), is much smaller, and much more quickly read and processed by a computer.

In theory.. FSX could use the Gmax files as model files.. but it would require terribly bulky code in FSX..

[Hagar]

As far as editing stuff like model-dependent lighting from a hex-editor ? It would require more effort to learn and accomplish that task, than it would to build a new model from scratch. Anything other than very specific, conditional switches (like we used to "turn off" VCs), means messing around blindly in a china shop, that has houses of cards in it too, and the lights are turned off..

I didn't say it was easy but it can be done. I used to do this sort of thing regularly back in the old days when models weren't as complex as they are now. We're talking about an early FS2002 model here or even one for FS2000. There are also utilities available for making various modifications to MDL files including converting FS9 models to work in FS2002 & CFS2.

I've investigated the RFP 747-200 that Chan mentioned. It appears that this is the Ready for Pushback aircraft that was originally Payware & created for FS2000. There is an updated version of this aircraft for FS9 which is now released as Freeware. I suggest trying that as it might not need modifying.

[Brett_Henderson]

As far as editing stuff like model-dependent lighting from a hex-editor ? It would require more effort to learn and accomplish that task, than it would to build a new model from scratch. Anything other than very specific, conditional switches (like we used to "turn off" VCs), means messing around blindly in a china shop, that has houses of cards in it too, and the lights are turned off..

I didn't say it was easy but it can be done. I used to do this sort of thing regularly back in the old days when models weren't as complex as they are now. We're talking about an early FS2002 model here or even one for FS2000. There are also utilities available for making various modifications to MDL files including converting FS9 models to work in FS2002 & CFS2.

I've investigated the RFP 747-200 that Chan mentioned. It appears that this is the Ready for Pushback aircraft that was originally Payware & created for FS2000. There is an updated version of this aircraft for FS9 which is now released as Freeware. I suggest trying that as it might not need modifying.

Yeah.. it's possible in theory.. But were talking about things like, conditional-appearance, variable transparency, probable animation.. part-hierarchy.. co-dependent materials...  Finding all the proper hex-entries.. and modifying them in ways that don't cascade problems throughout the model (the tiniest of which would simply render it uselsess), would be like finding the needle in the haystack and extracting it, without disturbing any of the hay.  :D

Now, though.. I'm curious and bored.. I'm wondering if there might be a simple, harmless edit, that just "shuts off", lighting. My instinct tells me that GMAX/MSFS doesn't discern it that discretely. I'll bet it's more along the lines of animation. You either have it, or you don't. The best we could hope to do, would be to "shut off" conditional appearance, and that would likely effect the prop and wheels  :-/

[ShaneG_old]

If I may, for a much simpler solution, would it be possible to set up a new lighting system in the aircraft.cfg and assign a key press for them and just not use the built in lighting system, thereby just bypassing them?

In this way the original author's work is left untouched and no copyrights are violated.

Just a thought.

[Hagar]

Chan didn't say which version of the aircraft he has or which version of FS this is for. I assume it's either FS9 or FSX. I tried the FS9 version of the aircraft he mentioned & the strobes appear to be defined in Aircraft.cfg. It's possible the adjustment he wants to make is no longer necessary. Try it for yourself. FS2004 Ready For Pushback Boeing 747-200 package v2

Yeah.. it's possible in theory.. But were talking about things like, conditional-appearance, variable transparency, probable animation.. part-hierarchy.. co-dependent materials...  Finding all the proper hex-entries.. and modifying them in ways that don't cascade problems throughout the model (the tiniest of which would simply render it uselsess), would be like finding the needle in the haystack and extracting it, without disturbing any of the hay.

There is a little utility that will do most of those things automatically. It will convert the FS9 default DC-3 to display correctly in CFS2 with a single click. I've tested it & it works very well.

[Alejandro Rhodes]

[quote]

As a freeware designer myself.. I'll freely distribute my source-code, to anyone who asks. If a person is capable of USING that source code in any

[Brett_Henderson]

There is a little utility that will do most of those things automatically. It will convert the FS9 default DC-3 to display correctly in CFS2 with a single click. I've tested it & it works very well.

Interesting.. but that's an entire model.. a fix along the lines of "shutting off" an entire VC. We're talking about editing a model... changing something specific, within it.