Citation Excel Project

[Oz]

Hey Katahu, I guess you misssed my post so i guess ill post it as another reply. What method of shaping do you use? the spline method or the normal mesh shaping? And what are the cons and pros of eac...and which is easier..?

BTW that VC looks amazing, nice work katahu

[Oz]

Ok, ive been workin in Gmax...



For now ive only worked on the side view...comments?
Also, ive got a little problem. I forgot to do the '3views on planes ' thing and have the 3 views set up (cropped of course, top, front etc.) as backrounds. I really have no problem with it. But its the size of each of the bitmaps thats the problem. The side view outlines are just a tad smaller than the top view outline and the side view and top view outlines are just a bit bigger than the front view ones.. So can someone please cut the Citation II bitmap up and resize the side, front etc.

[Excel560]

Great job you guys are doing.  The panel looks fantastic so far.  

Ill start posting some shots of the "must haves" on the Excel.  I want this thing to be perfect.  Dont get mad if im kind of ordering you around but ill post some of the more finer points of the aircraft that it must have.

[Felix/FFDS]

and if it doesn't have them, will you demand your money back?  :)

May I suggest that you really intended the tone of the posting to be: "Details to make the Citation project better"  rather than "must haves" ...

I'm sure that the Citation Project team will appreciate the details.

[quote]Great job you guys are doing.

[jlvandem]

Katahu the cockpit is looking amazing! When you're finished could you e-mail it to me so I can add it to the Excel? I finally figured out how to scale the 3-views just before you posted it. Now that I've got that all worked out I'm fine tuning the shapes I had already completed to match the 3-views. It's amazing how Felix did that CJ1 so fast and I've hardly even begun the Excel really. Oz the CJ2 is looking great too. Now I'd like to see what Adam has completed also. I know I keep promising pics of the Excel but right now if I showed you it would appear I've gone backwards but I promise I'll have some soon, like in a few hours from this post hopefully.

Justin

[adam_h]

Hey everyone, Ok I have been reading the Tut's and starting to pick up the stuff.  I am still playing around but  playing around means shaping the CJ 525 etc.. I hope I am not pushing us behind schedule just I want to make the model as real as possible.  I am still trying to learn all the tools and it is very complicated.  Once again thanks for all your help everyone

[jlvandem]

 Don't worry about a schedule Adam because there isn't one. It's just a hobby and we're working on this in our free time. It shouldn't become a full time job unless we were making $$$. But because I hate payware it will never bring in cash. Just the satisfaction that we've done something great.
 And finally as promised, some screenshots...







The landing gear that I have started in this picture is probably gonna be scrapped. It's one of the few remaining parts from when I imported this model from FSDS v1 (Yeah this thing is that old!). If anyone is intersted I also have a Cessna 404 Titan II in FSDS v1 that I don't plan on finishing.

Justin

[Katahu]

Answer to Oz's question:

Splines are usually used for making complicated models like sports cars (Nissan Skyline) and faces of people. Splines are very good for handling the complex curves that the model will have.

However it does have its downsides. Using the spline a lot for making the curves will mean that the polygon count will be EXTREMELY high (the high number needed for the curviture).

Splines are not very useful when it comes to making aircraft. Aircraft are made better with simple objects (boxes, cylinders, spheres, etc). If you try to use a spline to make an aircraft, you will then have to individually move the points (vertices) one by on so that carefully match the surface. And that will take forever.

As for the meshsmoothing, it is a modifier that is commonly use for basic objects so that you can smooth out the surface of the objects. I'm not going into detail on how to use the features (that is the purpose of the tutorials). Those details are too complex anyways.

The cockpit wall that you see (interior) is really a simple cylinder that has its Normals (polygon surface) flipped inside-out. Then the flipped surface is then extruded as a unit (it comes in the same size though). Then I use Uniform and Non-Uniform Scale tools to size up and stretch the extruded surface.

Then I add the mesh smooth modifier to the object. Where it says itterations in the modifier tab, I increase the number if I want (in this case, the number 2). The higher the itteration, the more smooth the surface is. But also the higher the polygon count.

Note:

I do not collapse the modifier stack for any reason. By keeping the stack as it is, I can go back and forth on the modifiers to make any needed changes. From here, it gets a bit complicated.

Answer to Jlvandam's question:

Sure, I'll send you the cockpit model. I'll compress it for easy sending.

[Felix/FFDS]

I'll take the FSDSv1 bits and pieces - I have no problem cannibalizing - especially landing gear bits!


The CJ1 is an FSDS "quickie" I want to use it as a "How to" model ... so I'm deliberately "rushing" it.  The idea is not so much to make it a ultra-detailed model with all the bells and whistles (Excel560 is not going to like me for that), but rather a "gee I can do this" guide, a cut above a basic tube with wings model...




[quote]

[jlvandem]

 Hey Felix I e-mailed you the Titan.

 Hey Katahu I have one quick question. How do you flip the polygons so that I can make the interior? Also when you use the extrude to you only extrude the edges around the outside or do you extrude the whole shape? Thanks.

Justin

[Katahu]

Fliping the polygons to make the interior is as easy as it sounds.

1. First, turn your object into an Editable Poly (in the modifier stack).
2. You should know that the Editable Poly modifier has 5 sub-levels (vertex, edge, border, polygon, and element).
3. Select the Element sub-level.
4. Select the object to be flipped.
5. In the Modifier Tab, scroll down until you see a LONG, horizontal button named "Flip Normals".
6. From here, the object should be flipped by now.

As for your second question:

You extrude the new interior by the WHOLE shape.

The extruded surface may come out at an odd angle, but don't worry. It's natural.

From here, just line up and size up (or down. hehe) the extruded surface so that it will look more like the interior.

I hope I made myself clear.

Quick tip: Do not collapse the modifier stack. That way, you can move back and forth between levels (this gives you more control over your selected object).

[jlvandem]

Thanks for the tips Katah. I'm still a little confused on the extruding of and object. If I've made a DVC and have all of the polygons facing inward so that they only appear if you are looking from the inside of the object and then I extrude the object will the whole DVC have polygons facing outward on the outside and inward on the inside? I would experiment with this in Gmax right now but I'm not at home. Could you please explain this just a bit more? Thanks.

Justin

[Katahu]

Just now, I have already animated the yokes and have added a pair of pilot figures (the ones you see in freeflightdesign.com).

About the pilot figures:

I am only using these pilot models and ejection seats only as a referance. Later on, they will be deleted.

I'm still waiting for a pic of the cockpit's rear part (where you see the cockpit door, and flat wall).

Now that I have gotten this far into the process, I will now ask for some cockpit textures.

Here is a little list of textures I'm looking for at this point.

1. side panels (if possible, include the textures for the cup-holders as well)
2. cockpit floor (I can use the ones Oz gave me for Project Have Blue, but they don't seem practical for an aircraft like this)
3. throttle textures (the pic shows that the throttle grips are black)
4. And central console (in the photo image, you saw the narrow control unit that is between the 2 seats) textures with throttle unit textures if possible.

I'll tell you when I need the rest of the textures later on.

I'll provide the pics after I am through adding the intended seats.

This is what's left to add so far:

1. Textures
2. backwall and cockpit door
3. the ACTUAL seats
4. add rudder pedals and animate them.

[Oz]

Ill try and send you some Learjet-type VC textures

[Oz]

A little something i started for the heck of it..



The wings and tail and engines are just for show, they are not 'professionaly made' and should be either redone or modified. I dont think im gonna continue with this model since theres a lot to be done on it (exteriorwise) and needs some modifications. So ill send it to anyone who wants to complete it...either katahu or justin or adam..